Have any of you ever tried making K2CO3? If not, where have you gotten it if you even have? Im think it is also used in gardening. I want to try some "yellow powder." What are your expierences with that if any? Thanks in advance.

Monkeyman666

EDIT: I did find this on Rat's list: Potassium carbonate also known as pearl ash, or potash; may be found in some pool/spa pH raising products; used in pottery/ceramics; photo chemical; clean hardwood ashes contain a considerable amount (but for most purposes would want purification), but still have never found any. I think it is just basically carbonated potassium hydroxide.

[This message has been edited by Monkeyman666 (edited 09-25-2002).]

Thanks for reminding me about that stuff.

If anyone does not know what "yellow powder" is, here is the formula from "Improvised Primary Explosives"
(this took me a while to copy it by re-typing)
----
"YELLOW POWDER"

This is a "forgotten" fun explosive
It's very easy to make from common accessible items.
The manufacturing is not dangerous in any way.
This powder burns 8.5 times faster than commercial black powder.
If it�s pressed in a tube, no detonation occurs, but when the powder is molten apon an iron plate in its uncompressed form, it turns brown and then it detonates with a loud �bang�.

1. Mix 4 grams of dry potassium nitrate and 2 grams of dry potassium carbonate (baking ingredient) in a mortar and pestle. Grind together to a fine powder.

2. Weigh out 4.5 grams of the above powder
and add 1 part sulfur. Grind carefully together.

This yellow powder explodes heavily when molten by a match flame, ect.
Store airtight.
Try detonating it in metal tubes.
It�s not shock sensitive.

I've never been able to get that stuff to work. Maybe my potassium carbonate isn't up to spec...

~Zero

potassium carbonate (baking ingredient)

by anychance do u htink they might mean potassium bi-carbonate? thats a baking ingredient

Does that stuff have a velocity high enough to make a good detonator?

I'd doubt it. It would be hard to pull off, too, because you need to melt the stuff to make it detonate.

I can't find potassium carbonate anywhere, but I did stumble upon a good source of sodium carbonate...

Does anyone think this will work instead? I've yet to find any good information on yellow powder on the web. Perhaps someone knows something I don't.

I am pretty sure that it would work. Sodium nitrate can replace potassium nitrate, so why not with carbonates? I am not 100 percent sure, but I really think that it will work.

Chances are, the "recipe" you have is a little detached from reality. Most of the "recipes" say that you can just mix sodium carbonate, sulfur, and potassium nitrate to get a powerful explosive. Or that you can melt it without risk (WRONG, it's very dangerous to do that). A very powerful mix is a mix of sodium or potassium polysulfide and sodium or potassium nitrate. I believe it explodes forcefully enough to be used in detonators.

That's a possibility, as well. On that note, has anyone ever gotten the Nitrate/Carbonate/Sulfur mix to work? I don't mean by a detonation, just by it burning with enough speed and force to make it useful as a low explosive.

I could test it, I suppose, but that'll mean six bucks for a bottle of sodium carbonate for a mixture that may or may not work.

~Zero

A very trustworthy friend of mine said it worked by making it and then heating it with a lighter to make a "pop".

Well, isnt chalk calcium carbonate, which might work. I am very interested now in making this, and I plan on making it when I order some more potassium nitrate.

A mix of sulfur, potassium carbonate, and potassium nitrate is going to fizzle weakly at best.

I've been resarching this a bit.

It turns out that what we're really after here is fulminating powder, a mixture of potassium/sodium polysulfide and potassium/sodium nitrate.

The polysulfide can be made by heating sulfur with potassium or sodium carbonate - Thus the mixture Rat_Bastard outlined. I haven't been able to make it work with just a dry mix, though. According to everyone I talk to the key to the preparation is to form the polysulfide first.

Once I find the proper ratios for forming the polysulfide and mixing the fulminating powder I will post them.

The upshot of all this is that fulminating powder is extremely powerful. It could prove to be quite useful stuff.

~Zero

[This message has been edited by Zero the Inestimable (edited 09-27-2002).]

2K2CO3 + 5S --(heat)--> 2K2S2 + SO2 + 2CO2

2KOH + 4S ----> K2S2 + SO2 + H2S

Beware of H2S! It is ***EXTREMELY*** toxic! It has a very strong sulfurous odor, and it has an anesthetic effect on the nose, so you won't smell it for long! So if you smell sulfur, and then the odor suddenly disappears, clear the hell out of the immediate vicinity if you want to live! H2S is more toxic than HCN!

You'll have to enlighten me, here.

Potassium carbonate heated with sulfur forms potassium polysulfude, sulfur dioxide and carbon dioxide (the latter two escape into the air, I'd imagine).

What's the deal with the potasium hydroxide, and where are you pulling it from? I don't see how that has anything to do with the polysulfide reaction.

~Zero

80g NaOH + 128g S ----> 110g Na2S2 + 22.4L SO2 + 22.4L H2S

112.2g KOH + 128g S ----> 142.2g K2S2 + 22.4L SO2 + 22.4L H2S

138.2g K2CO3 + 160g S ----> 284.4g K2S2 + 22.4L SO2 + 44.8L CO2

212g Na2CO3 + 160g S ----> 220g Na2S2 + 22.4L SO2 + 44.8L CO2

All of these reactions can be carried out by heating the two reactants dry. They can be done also by heating the two reactants in water, but that certainly is far from the best process. The best way to do it is to mix the reactants in denatured alcohol, and warm gently. Polysulfides are yellow compounds that are soluble in ethanol and water.

I first grilled some baking soda for 2.5 hours. Then I added powdered sulfur to the result and mixed well in a ziplock bag, and then grilled this too for 45 minutes. It went a little too long this time, so 1/2 is about good. Then NaNO3 was added in the proper proportions. The polysulfide was chunky and hard. I didn't mix either very well. When ignited it burned through tin foil and burned like weak BP. I will test some better stuff soon.

I attempted to make some sodium polysulfate yesterday but succeeded only in creating some very carefully engineered dirt.

I believe I overcooked the mixture and the reaction ran away, producing its own heat and eventually decomposing all of the end product.

I'll try again tomorrow... I'll have synthesis details as soon as I get it right.

~Zero