Blah blah, "God" doesn't exist. Blah blah, you can't prove he does, you can't explain him, blah blah blah.

Alright, given that, lemme turn the situation around for a moment. I'm not a Christian, but I am a universal religion advocate. I believe that everyone should practice the religion they want, and I *DON'T* then proceed to say that anyone who follows religion X is stupid.

For all you "atheistic knowitalls" who demand proof of God or other divinity, answer:

Gravity is the force that allows the Earth to orbit the Sun, the Moon to orbit the Earth, etc. All objects exert gravity, but when you get lots and lots of an object in "one place" (like say, a planet...), then the object has enough gravity to affect other objects on a large scale.

But... what causes gravity? A particle pulls on other particles with an extermely short-ranged force that causes particles to stick together, we know that. But if these particles exhibited a gravitational pull as well, atomic structures would collapse in nanoseconds.

Think of a heat source. A heat source, like gravity, radiates out this heat/pull based on how big it is. Except, the heat being radiated is the production of a series of chemical reactions. There is no such effect producing gravity.

Gravity, additionally, works on an inverse square formula for strength. That is: objects twice as far away are subject to only a quarter the gravity. Yet, gravity is a constant based on the mass of the object. One would think that being on one side of the planet, the gravity from 99% of the planet would be negligible. Not the case though!

And that's just a common, everyday concept, not even stepping into esoteric fields like Quantum Mechanics or Chaos Theory. So explain that one to me before you talk about being unable to prove he existence of God.

I'd like to know why a God who created everything else to be logical, would leave something else to work by magic?
Even if there is a god, I doubt that he/she would contradict everything he has ever done for a few exceptional cases?

Simple: To stump the scientists who probe too deep looking for rational answers to everything, when not everything needs a rational answer.

way to circumnavigate the point.

Why would "God" care about such a thing?
No more stupid BS please.

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way to circumnavigate the point.

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Just returning the favour. The point of the article WASN'T to prove that God exists because we can't explain gravity. It was to say that Science doesn't hold all the answers any more than religion does.

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Why would "God" care about such a thing?
No more stupid BS please.

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Why WOULDN'T he care? Really. These people (like you seemingly) are going out of their way to prove he doesn't exist. And if you succeed in convincing someone of God's non-existance on grounds of shaky science (and if he does in fact exist), then you are dooming that person to damnation. Is that what God would want? I think not. He supposedly loves everyone, so he wants you to be with him.

*looks back on what he wrote and gags at the over personalization of God*

Long and short: God creates things like that to prove to people that he exists. He staggers them out a bit, so that people can't find the "answer" to all of them at once. Originally, it was obvious things like volcanoes and hurricanes. Now that we've found the "answer" to them, there are more subtle things.

Since you seem to want concrete evidence that God exists, and won't accept visions, scriptures, spontaneous conversions, or stories about his physical incarnation on the Earth, there isn't much left, now is there?

I don't care about disproving God or Science.

What you're saying is idiocy.
Not everything is understood, I'll agree with you there. But what kind of a God would leave loop holes in his perfect design? it makes not sense.
You assume too much of your god.

I really am not trying to be some know-it-all Atheist, I'm just using common sense.
The God believed in by most people needs nothing but faith, so why would he screw up his creation to "prove" his existance?

Listen to yourself for a second. You're saying God "screwed up" his perfect creation.

1 - Are you perfect? If not, how can you judge something to be not-perfect?

2 - You're assuming that if it doesn't follow the rules of science, or if science can't explain it, then it's screwed up. That's a rather screwed up perspective in and of itself

The Doozy is why God would create something to defy the scientific rules he set up.
He'd be directly contradicting his or her self

Once again, you're missing the point. God didn't set up scientific rules, mankind did.

Assuming divine creation:

God created gravity. God said "gravity will pull things closer to big things so my little people won't fall off the planet... and there will be no rational reason!"

He created effects. Scientific causes aren't necessary for things to work if you accept divine power.

There is no contradiction here.

... and I'm back to arguing against Insanity.

You tell yourself whatever you need, I'm done.

(this is not consent in defeat, it is my realization that you will make up a thousand and one excuses before you scrap that idea)

The general idea is that, just because something can't be proven all together, doesn't mean it's the work of God, or his flaw. It can't really be proven either way, so arguing it, will have you going in circles.

We, all of us, are co-creators of our own reality. If you choose not to see or hear god, so be it. God will not lose any sleep over this, nor will he (male pronoun used for convenience only) punish you. Nor will he show up on your doorstep looking like fucking George Burns demanding that you believe in him. Yea verily, the Age of Pisces is dying hard.

Nobody is right guys, Cod you have good points, and bogey your just batteling them with cynacism, and saying god wouldnt be interested in that. Cod, there is NO proof either way, so an ethiest is just as FAITHful in a non-belief, that a christian is FAITHful in a belief. You cant take a logical side on this argument, im afriad you have to sit on the fence and wait untill you die.

Bogeyman and Arms-Merchant, you're missing the point.

Just because something can't be proven doesn't mean that it can't exist. You see gravity in effect 24/7, and you never doubt it's existence because you can't explain how it works. Some people feel God 24/7 in their soul, so why should they doubt his existence because he can't be proven?

[This message has been edited by ProphetOfCod (edited 01-31-2003).]

I dont have a problem with people believing in God, but your arugument, in my opinion, is crap.
It is the same basic argument of "well then, if God didn't create the universe, what did?" and I assume most of us can see the failed logic in that (oh oh... "not everything is logical... bla bla", in my world it is)