How many among this disturbing new crowd can say they have always lived true to the fundamentals of a racialist worldview? I get the impression that a lot of you kids were smokin weed and listening to Ja Rule last school year, but thought some skinhead in town was cool and hopped on a new train.

quote:

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Originally posted by Spirit of '22:
How many among this disturbing new crowd can say they have always lived true to the fundamentals of a racialist worldview? I get the impression that a lot of you kids were smokin weed and listening to Ja Rule last school year, but thought some skinhead in town was cool and hopped on a new train.

---

You would have to do drugs to be stupid enough to buy into racism or some of the extreme anti-semitism that idiots post in this forum. (Although I am completely against anti-semitism, I am not against anti-israelism, and some say that is anti-semitism, which it is not)

Homer

you would have to be on drugs to buy Ja rule too

LOL, wasn't SATURNROCKETX a "former wigger"?

I reckon most of them could just have easily wound up with Che Guevera T-shirts and copies of Das Kapital and spent their time on here passionately defending Fidel Castro.

quote:

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Originally posted by FuckOffandDie:
I reckon most of them could just have easily wound up with Che Guevera T-shirts and copies of Das Kapital and spent their time on here passionately defending Fidel Castro.

---

They would have done that, thirty years ago. And Che Guevara IS back in fashion, as a freedom fighter, if not as a Communist. To some extent it is about trends, rather than active, personal political thinking.

But not trends without a cause. Thirty years ago, to become a Communist was a protest against USA, because of the Vietnam war. Assuming that the Soviet Union had still been alive and well, we would probably have had another wave of Communism now, because the Soviets would of course have followed the - weird - rules of the Cold war, and sided with Al Qaida, and with Saddam.

Instead we have a recent wave of racism that Spirit didn�t mention in his introduction. A kind of racism that I wonder if anybody of you have thought about as racism.

USA (or America, as it is more often, and wrongly, called) is said to be evil, and the US Americans are therefore considered to be an evil collective, or people. The same thing happened during the Vietnam war, but then it was channeled through Communism, and got some kind of political balance. This time it unwittingly repeats Usama bin Laden�s "teachings"; USA is evil and the US Americans are evil. (To point out that US Americans are not a race, is to miss the point in this). People in the anti-Globalisation movement were the first ones to get on this train, and they are in all essentials the younger cousins of the Make Peace Not War groups who protested against the war in Vietnam. and therefore became Communists.

Radical Islam - Farrahkan et al - already belong to the Islamist International, and are, of course, also spreading the anti-USA, anti-Jewish message. Rap music brings that message to the youngsters (mostly black people in USA, perhaps; but all youngsters in Europe).

For (partly) the same reasons, anti-semitism is growing right now. Then evrything becomes USA�s and Israels fault. The Jews and the US Americans are to blame, as collectives; as people. A lot of patriotic US Americans single out the Jews. Those of them who think, do as Homer, and make a distinction between: Israel and neo-Zionism on the side to blame (to some extent), and the Jews on the other side, as a group of individuals who can�t be collectively blamed for anything.

The popularity of conspiracy litterature ("fact" and fiction) is probably also to blame. Nine out of ten theories single out the US government as the culprits (X-files included). More than two thirds of those who do, say that "the Jews" are the ones who manipulate the US government; ZOG, NWO, Illuminati, etc.

Both western Europe and USA have problems with immigration. A lot of people, young and old, feel threatened by this. Many choose the seemingly easy way out; stop immigration. When they want to find a political party or group with stop immigration on the agenda, they are likely to stumble over a party/group who are also, or even foremost, anti-semites.

When dogma enters the brain, all intelectual activity ceases.

FoxLeonard



[This message has been edited by FoxLeonard (edited 11-18-2002).]

I used to be a leftist, but now I've moved away from that (in disgust) after studying differing opinions. I'm not into "skinheads". Skinheads are a youth subculture. I have no time for youth subcultures. I have been studying the Jewish tribe, however, because they're a fascinating subject.

quote:

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Originally posted by Spirit of '22:
How many among this disturbing new crowd can say they have always lived true to the fundamentals of a racialist worldview? I get the impression that a lot of you kids were smokin weed and listening to Ja Rule last school year, but thought some skinhead in town was cool and hopped on a new train.

---

I find Mouses turn around the most fascinating.

As for me, well, you know the answer.

[This message has been edited by preying mantis (edited 11-18-2002).]

When the facts (or my knowledge of the facts) change, I change my opinion.

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMouse:
When the facts (or my knowledge of the facts) change, I change my opinion.

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yes, the "facts" changed your opinion.

in every other subject mouse, you seem to be an inteligent person, but in that of race, you are an ignorant pig.

I got $50 that says mouse was mugged by some jewish guy/ black guy/ generic minority and decided to be a skinhead.

>you would have to be on drugs to buy Ja rule too

Most are.

Homer

quote:

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yes, the "facts" changed your opinion.

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That's right.

quote:

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in every other subject mouse, you seem to be an inteligent person, but in that of race, you are an ignorant pig.

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Why am I called the ignorant one when you can't refute anything, nor make an intelligent arguement? All you can do is insult and act all pissed off. That's not very convincing.

quote:

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I got $50 that says mouse was mugged by some jewish guy/ black guy/ generic minority and decided to be a skinhead.

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I could use that $50 bucks now. I need some extra cash to buy Christmas presents for my family. That was a bad bet to make, considering that I stated in my above post that I have no use for youth subculture such as "skinheads". Didn't get mugged, either. The minorities I live around now are Chinese, and they don't make a habit of prowling the neighborhood mugging people like the ghettorats of LA.

Do you plan on sending?

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMouse:
I could use that $50 bucks now. I need some extra cash to buy Christmas presents for my family. That was a bad bet to make, considering that I stated in my above post that I have no use for youth subculture such as "skinheads". Didn't get mugged, either. The minorities I live around now are Chinese, and they don't make a habit of prowling the neighborhood mugging people like the ghettorats of LA.

Do you plan on sending?

---

See, the thing about it is, I lied.
I don't have $50, but if you want to give me your address, I am sure I could arrange a letterbomb (joke).

There is no intelligent argument on either side of the racist issue.
It is as opinionated as religion.

Homer

There are plenty of intelligent arguements around. You won't find them by relying on popular dogma, however.

Fox seemed to have the most intelligent remarks about this post. Racism is about feeling superior to another human. It is not based on intellectual acheivements, nor physical ones. It is based on what part of the world your ancestors evolved from. The government of Israel sucks, probably almost as bad as US's or any other country. Jews are the same as any other human being. Anybody that is truly racist here has never had a relationship with a black, hispanic, jew, etc... in their life.

I've always been a conservative, although I used to be more of a Libertarian, Ayn-Randish type.

Then again, I'm only a racialist, not an anti-semite.

quote:

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Racism is about feeling superior to another human.

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That's one definition. Another definition is simply that different races have different predispositions through genetic traits. One doesn't have to "feel superior" to subscribe to this theory. For example, I could believe that Japanese people tend to be very intelligent. How would this make me, a white woman, feel superior?

Well, maybe not superior to the Japanese, but at least the "ghetto rats."

Truthfully tell me that you don't feel superior to people who smoke crack, mug, and shoot people.

HomerJay is already a racist. He has admitted that there is a seperation of humans by biological traits.

Therefore he is a racist as me or you.

Mouse and myself and others are not racists or supremists, we just want to live in a white country. Every non-white nation enjoys that right, and so should we.

Just because no other race has the ability to build a strong nation, then why the hell should support those who can't be bothered to build up their own nation, and instead come here looking for the easy ticket?

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMouse:
When the facts (or my knowledge of the facts) change, I change my opinion.

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No i find it fascinating that you and me would argue against each other on issues we nbow agree on.

Just out of interest, what finally pushed you to the other side? Was it a book or a friend?

I feel superior to people because of their actions and choices. To me, that is the deciding line.

As would i, but HomerJay here rants like a rabid dog and would have everyone here belive some of us are nazi supremist thugs.

quote:

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Just out of interest, what finally pushed you to the other side? Was it a book or a friend?

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Neither. It was other liberals. I made a thread a while back about how other liberals annoyed me into waking up.

Interesting. I wasn't visiting TOTSE for a while so you must have posted it then. I don't remember the change of heart anyway, but i'm glad of it.

quote:

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Originally posted by preying mantis:
HomerJay is already a racist. He has admitted that there is a seperation of humans by biological traits.

Therefore he is a racist as me or you.

Mouse and myself and others are not racists or supremists, we just want to live in a white country. Every non-white nation enjoys that right, and so should we.

Just because no other race has the ability to build a strong nation, then why the hell should support those who can't be bothered to build up their own nation, and instead come here looking for the easy ticket?

---

I swear to god, that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard.
No country is completely of one race, and those that are close SUCK.
You want to go live in a white country, go find and buy an island. You don't have to let minorities onto any island that you buy.

Homer

Are you saying that Japan sucks? Japan is pretty close to racially homogenous.

How about Europe pre-immigration floods? Are you saying that Europe sucked before European countries began letting in Africans, Arabs, and Asians?

Pre-1965 immigration act, America was about 89% white. Are you saying that all of America's greatness throughout it's history was because of the 10% of blacks?


People like you are why I turned away from anti-racism. No logic at all. On one hand you'll say that race doesn't matter at all, then on another you'll say that the mixing of races is essential for a good society. Both propositions make no sense alone, and they completely conflict when put together.

About your island idea, would you tell an African in Africa, a Chinese in China, a Japanese in Japan, or an Arab in Saudi Arabia that he should go buy an island if he thinks that his country should belong to his people?

Do you have a problem with people having mixed babies, or do you just not see it as essential?

I used to be a card caring Communist, and I supported every action ever taken by Stalin, Mao, and even to an extent, Pol Pot.

Now I'm simply a half assed Marxist, and while I agree with the teachers of Marx, I won't subscribe myself to any sort of specific political doctrine. I tihnk people change in general because their interpretations of facts change. Maybe they mature. Who knows.

Mouse, do you actually believe that the reason black people are in such a horrible situation is because they're geneticly inferior to white people? You think they smoke crack and mug people because it's in their blood as negroes.

I personally think that to believe this, you have to be either insecure about yourself, recovering from parental neglect, guilty for how your life has turned out, or you need to be a herd animal.

But to each his own. By the way, crack coaine is most common among white teenagers in the suburbans. Black urban teenagers are second place.

I am a former wigger yes, but that being about nine years ago when I was 15. A little different than being a wiggers at twenty and I've seen them as old as forty five!
I have never been a trendy though. I had a beef with society and I agreed with shooting and insulting people. Still do, but I understand the problems better than I did before as continual research infers for me.
I still don't like most White people and I feel their fate at the hands of niggers justified by their actions. I still sympathize with the negro so far as his disgust at White hypocrisy goes, and I also hate the liberal scumbags who attempt to integrate them into poor White society at the expense of only the poor Whites. But I still support the extermination of the black race.
Thats the problem with television and growing up in a atomized society. I wouldn't hold your breath in anticipation of you ever having one over on me, however.

I did not hang out with blacks and hated the niggers as much as they hated me. Thats the product of White comfort and selfishness, arrogance, not a produce of any personal faults with me.
When I saw even crazy KKK members on talk shows I ALWAYS sided with them. I support the idea of skinheads without having met one, as soon as I saw one on television (never having seen one in person).
I am aghast at the foppish attitude adopted by about half of the current White racialists towards skinheads. They are NOT the inferior of said fops. They are doing what we will ALL have to do prior to having our own organized armies, although you may strut and sniff at them now in your ignorance and inflated self-opinion.

I have read The Turner Diaires at 14 and joined the National Alliance only two years ago, having since left the organization as a personal decision. I cannot know of the facts "Spirit of 22" if I do not have access to those facts and not all of us could afford PCs or access to the internet. Some of us have to start at the bottom and we are so ASHAMED
Well thats enough for now.

[This message has been edited by SATURNROCKETX (edited 11-19-2002).]

Saturn, Adolf Hitler would be ashamed of your conformist ass. You'd probably get gassed for being so fucking stupid.

At least Spirit actualy has ideals that he firmly believes in. To me, you just wanna go with whatever trend turns the most heads.

Unless I learned this wrong, genetics determines your physical gifts and mental potential. How you develop as a person and how you choose to use those gifts are a product of your environment and your own self choice. The question I am asking here is do you believe the entire burden of existance to be placed upon genetics?

Well. Your wrong. Being a White racist, especially an open and natural one, attracts lots of shit. Unlike being a commie activist, the jews and government actually use violent and clever crafts against pro-White activists. We are actual enemies of the state, not McDonalds Will Smith juice drinker trendies.

[This message has been edited by SATURNROCKETX (edited 11-19-2002).]

quote:

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Originally posted by NukeChild:
Unless I learned this wrong, genetics determines your physical gifts and mental potential. How you develop as a person and how you choose to use those gifts are a product of your environment and your own self choice. The question I am asking here is do you believe the entire burden of existance to be placed upon genetics?

---

I think genetics determine human potential. Genetics determine behavior, emotions, intellectual form and capacity and desires and proclivities. Enviroment can warp, stunt, deprive or facilitate these potentials and behavior.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
Mouse, do you actually believe that the reason black people are in such a horrible situation is because they're geneticly inferior to white people? You think they smoke crack and mug people because it's in their blood as negroes.

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I think there are many reasons why black people act a certain way, all combined with disastrous results. Africa is a primitive country full of primitive people. As for American blacks, they have a culture of dependence (can't do anything without the government helping), anti-intellectualism (studying is for white geeks), entitlement (whitey owes me), and anti-family (the males impregnating all the girls while young and not providing for the kids they made). Genetics or culture? Regardless of what it is, they need to get their own shit together and stop blaming every else - and many people would prefer them to get their shit together somewhere alone so that others aren't injured in the process.

quote:

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I personally think that to believe this, you have to be either insecure about yourself

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Isn't it more insecure to hate your own race?

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recovering from parental neglect

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Wouldn't hating your own race be a symptom of parental neglect?

quote:

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guilty for how your life has turned out

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?????

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or you need to be a herd animal.

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Uncl, think with me for a sec.. the "crowd" says that all racism is bad, multiculturalism is good, diversity is our strength, yada yada. Racism is the most hated philosophy of the times. People don't even consider that what racists say because we've all been indoctrinated to have a knee-jerk "racism = bad" reaction to everything. I used to be that way, and it was almost total knee-jerk. There's nothing "herdish" about breaking away from the dogma and rethinking the ideas that we've all been taught are "evil" since we entered pre-school.

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But to each his own. By the way, crack coaine is most common among white teenagers in the suburbans. Black urban teenagers are second place.

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Back this up please.

quote:

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I am aghast at the foppish attitude adopted by about half of the current White racialists towards skinheads. They are NOT the inferior of said fops. They are doing what we will ALL have to do prior to having our own organized armies, although you may strut and sniff at them now in your ignorance and inflated self-opinion.

---

Saturn, there are different types of skinheads. Have you ever met the type of skins who are like 13-17 years old and decided to become a skin just because they saw Romper Stomper and thought it looked hardcore? I have, and it's goofy. They're the type of kids that reinforced my "anti-racism" knee-jerk liberalism. They just ran around really drunk putting graffiti up everywhere screaming "Heil Hitler!". I never understood how it's "pro-white" to act like a drunken hoodlum. Maybe Spirit's right about things just all being freakish and warped in California, but that's the kind of stuff I saw there. Of course none of this analysis applies to the decent kids that think for themselves and don't just join a group to get drunk, fight, and vandalize shit and pretend you're something hardcore.

So from what I understand of that post Saturn, we are all born with certain tendancies and directions and the interactions of those tendancies with our environement determines the type of person we are. Wouldn't this then mean that all people have to be approached as individuals and judged as individuals rather than labeled and boxed into a certain group? I say this becuase all basis for categorizing seems to have been destroyed.

My thoughts and philosophies have followed a logical, predictable, linear evolution since 8 or so. I never really felt differently than I do now.

And Uncl, yes, blacks are genetically worthless when it comes to being white, just as whites are genetically worthless when it comes to being black. A million and one of their behavioral, "cultural" handicaps are a direct result of their tropical evolution- ie- their biology.

The following is an excerpt from the American Zionist Movement homepage: http://www.azm.org/jprog.html

quote:

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The program of work of the Zionist Organization is:
1.Encouragement of immigration, absorption and integration of immigrants; support of Youth Aliyah; stimulation of agricultural settlement and economic development; acquisition of land as the property of the people.

2.Intensive work for halutziut (pioneering) and hachsharah (training for halutziut).

3.Concerted effort to harness funds in order to carry out the tasks of Zionism.

4.Encouragement of private capital investment.

5.Fostering of Jewish consciousness by propagating the Zionist idea and strengthening the Zionist Movement; imparting the values of Judaism; Hebrew education and spreading the Hebrew language.

6.Mobilization of world public opinion for Israel and Zionism.

7.Participation in efforts to organize and intensify Jewish life on democratic foundations, maintenance and defense of Jewish rights

---

and another from: http://www.azm.org/aboutus.html
[quote]AZM promotes and enhances creative Jewish continuity, using the magnetic force of Israel as a weapon against the destructive trends of assimilation and intermarriage; we are creating a new sense of Jewish self through identification with the people and the State of Israel.

look at this pro-zion site: site:http://www.kumah.org/neozionism.html

now replace Jew with white, replace neo-zion with neo-nazi, u get my drift. Does ANY of this sound familiar?
*cough*cough*Third Reich*cough*cough

Anti-semetism is a term that only has power because of the attitude we are taught to develop towards it. Anti-semetism does not exist. The Jews are hypocrites.

United they stand. Divided we fall.

Hitler has been Demonized for what he was trying to do. What are the Jews doing to the Palestinian people? What is the difference betweenn The Fatherland and The Promised Land? Pretext?
Jewish history teacher Paula Hyman of Columbia University has observed: "With regard to Israel, the Holocaust may be used to forestall political criticism and suppress debate; it reinforces the sense of Jews as an eternally beleaguered people who can rely for their defense only upon themselves. The invocation of the suffering endured by the Jews under the Nazis often takes the place of rational argument, and is expected to convince doubters of the legitimacy of current Israeli government policy."



[This message has been edited by Lionhart (edited 11-19-2002).]

"I think there are many reasons why black people act a certain way, all combined with disastrous results. Africa is a primitive country full of primitive people."

The Nubian and Aschenti civilizations prove you wrong. White civilizatiosn happened to prevail durring a certain time period for reasons that have nothing to do with Africans being "Primitive."

"As for American blacks, they have a culture of dependence (can't do anything without the government helping),"

Yeah, when they were slaves, they couldn't survive without their owners feeding them.

"anti-intellectualism (studying is for white geeks),"

YOu're right. When we first shipped them here from Africa, we tried to make them lawyers, but that didn't work out so we just put them in the fields. *rolleyes* *rolleyes*

"entitlement (whitey owes me),"

So what if we enslaved them and denied them basic human rights. Let bigones be bigones.

"and anti-family (the males impregnating all the girls while young and not providing for the kids they made)."

This occurs just as much among white people.

Genetics or culture? Regardless of what it is, they need to get their own shit together and stop blaming every else - and many people would prefer them to get their shit together somewhere alone so that others aren't injured in the process."

Again, are you saying we have't injured them by enslaving and oppressing them?

I support the jews, aside from the liberalism that has took root among certain of them. They've done a good job of preserving their identity.

blacks and whites are different. If blacks want to look down on white culture and blame us for their problems, why shoulden't we do the same, show them the same respect?
Its not like our generation had anything to do with slavery, we arent guilty for our fore-fathers actions. They arent slaves anymore either.
Black people are free now. They have been for 3 generations. Why is their slave history part of the way they act in todays society? I think they keep themselves down.

Not like slavery was unique to blacks, either.

You don't think blacks are still affected by slavery? We'll see what happens to your great grandson if we kidnap you, bring you to another country, enslave you, and finally release you without giving you a job, basic human rights, or enough money to return to your country.

Blacks haven't really been free, either. They've bene free on the books, but they haven't been free of prejudice in society. It hasn't been until recently that black people can get jobs as easily as white people. We're not to blame for slavery, but that doesn't mean the ancestor's of slaves aren't feeling it's affects.

Vene, I know slavery didn't only affect blacks. There are also black Americans that aren't ancestors of slaves, and that's one of the reasons I'm against affirmative action. That still doesn't mean black people are genetically non-intellectual and depndent on the government.

I can't be bothered to post much anymore.

I also forget what I was going to post.

Your arguements mean nothing. Blacks in Africa weren't enslaved by the White Man, and they have the same issues and more. A black person born nowadays won't feel the effects of slavery. What you're advocating is some bullshit theory of "Post Traumatic Stress Disorder" that lasts throughout the generations. Let's say my great great grandmother was horribly abused by her husband. How the hell does that effect me? Millions of people in Russia/Eastern Germany had to do forced labor in gulags long after American slavery was abolished. According to you, a hundred years from now their ancestors should all still be traumatized.

My great grandfather moved here to work in the coal mines when my grandfather was just a boy. Working the coal mines is hardly better than being a slave, and without knowing english, you get the same treatment a slave would. This doesn't affect me, other than making me realize money doesn't always come easy, so don't go off blowing it on shit you don't need.

Christ, I forget what I was thinking again.

This is what too many tests in one week does to you.

quote:

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Originally posted by NukeChild:
So from what I understand of that post Saturn, we are all born with certain tendancies and directions and the interactions of those tendancies with our environement determines the type of person we are. Wouldn't this then mean that all people have to be approached as individuals and judged as individuals rather than labeled and boxed into a certain group? I say this becuase all basis for categorizing seems to have been destroyed.

---

Not at all, and just the opposite. The reason is that behavior, tendencies, CAPACITIES, etc., are all determined by race, because race is genotype which is genes which is predictable to a great degree. Therefore categorization is greatly supported and can be understood clearly, its all race! Enviroment remains a modifier of whats there. You can't increase the mental capacity of blacks nor change their behavior, because all the chromosomes in all their billions of cells can't be changed!

the blacks who can outperform you in any given task would probably beg to differ...

There are averages and predispositions. It's not a strict universal rule that applies to everyone. If you look at everything from an individualist standpoint, like most Americans are accustomed to doing, you'll see that there are some blacks who excel over some whites, and thus think that there are no differences. If you look at everything from a group viewpoint, you'll see that whites generally excel over blacks, and that blacks are generally more violent. Blacks also have no genetic heritage of monogamy and high-investment parenting.

Welfare programs were the last thing in the world they needed because it rewarded low-investment parenting, which tends to produce large numbers of low-quality offspring instead of smaller numbers of high-quality offspring that comes with high-investment parenting. What generally leads to upward mobility and/or stable communities in Western societies are two-parent households in which both parents are committed to raising children who will succeed and disciplining him/her into following social norms.

Forefathers being enslaved has nothing to do with it. They have a genetic history of low-investment parenting, and now in America their are programs which reward that same pattern, which creates less disciplined children.

It has nothing to do with post traumatic stress. Black Americans today feel the affects of slavery because after we freed the slaves, we left them in poverty. We didn't try to put them all through college, we simply left them in an economic slump. Worse that that, we didn't allow them to go to college or get jobs.

As a race, African Americans didn't start out with opportunity and lost it. They never had it.

What you sady about blacks in Africa is also extremely flawed. Africa's civilizations thrived for hundreds of years, they simply were defeated by western expantion. Go back to 600 A.D. - where would you rather live, Europe in the dark ages, or Zimbabwe in a prosperous civilization?

The stereotypes you're claiming have no bearing in the real world. Blacks tend to be poor because they were enslaved in this country and left impoverished. The idea that blacks are anti-intellectual and dependent is total bullshit. Have you ever actually been around black people, or did you grow up in an all white community where all you knew about cultures other then your own was in movies? I'm not making any accusations, but I can say if you spent time around black people you'd discover that they're just as smart, capable, and determined as most white people. They just have less money.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
As a race, African Americans didn't start out with opportunity and lost it. They never had it.

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But they have it now. Opportunity means that you can obtain something if you work for it. Opportunity is not an entitlement. It is not something owed to you. It is something that you (the operative word) take advantage of.

Nox

I live in a suburb. We do, however, have a sizable Congoid population and a more sizable Meso-American population.

Most blacks are in the lower two levels of learning. None are in accelerated classes. Most blacks are vulgar and interuptive.

I think the reason we have so many racialists here is because many people are, on some level. I was in a class today, full of intelligent people, and we everyone seemed to think there were inequalties, but scared to go farther than that. They fear the reactions of those around them.

No shit Uncl? I thought you were some high-school kid in New York. Or, did he sell you the username?

I thought that I had you pegged as a female a couple of months back, so that theory is no good. So? out with it.

quote:

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I think the reason we have so many racialists here is because many people are, on some level. I was in a class today, full of intelligent people, and we everyone seemed to think there were inequalties, but scared to go farther than that. They fear the reactions of those around them.

---

Yeah, true. Most kids are raised with the message "racism = the most evil thing in the world" nowadays from day one. So they have to go through life either in denial or by making excuses. Some people, like me, eventually get tired of trying to prop up a house of cards and question why it's such a moral imperative to be anti-racist.

The thing everyone most approves of censoring is "racist" speech. Federal money can be given to an artist to desecrate the Christian religion, but if you are accused of racism you're like a pariah. This makes no sense. If races really were all equal and diversity really were such a good thing, then why the hysteria and calls for government intervention if someone strays from the herd? Only a weak philosophy that can't stand on it's own requires federal intervention to back it up.

I go to high school in New York, but I'm French. I'm a dual citizen, but I was born in France.

There are cultural inequalities. I don't know very many people that deny that. It's obvious that black people do worse in school, and it's well known that as a race they're dormant and not progressing, and there's more crime and poverty among them.

The question is whether this is the fault of their inferior genetics, which some people claim, or whether it's a situation that came into being because of historical events, that have nothing to do with how capable black people are.

Nobody's answered my question. What did we do to slaves when we freed them? Did we try to make them doctors and lawyers? While I acknowledge that races have physical differences, all human brains have the same standards of capability. Explain exactly what a group of people could possibly do to better their situation after being released from slavery without pennies to their names, and no skills or training in any area. If caucasions were in that situation at some point somewhere, what would they have done?

Whites have been enslaved. Whites have even been brought over to the US enslaved. No one ever went on some campaign to turn every white person into a doctor or lawyer. Most white people have had tough lives and worked hard, and still do. Blacks picked cotton on a field and were fed, clothed, and sheltered for it. Many whites had to work long grueling hours at some factory or mine, didn't get clothed, fed, or sheltered by his boss, and was paid low wages.

Many whites immigrated to US and Canada penniless, and no one campaigned to give them welfare benefits or free rides to collage. My husband's family came to Canada as penniless refugees from Romania after the Soviets stole everything they had from them (they were filthy bourgeois pigs). Now, they're middle class and comfortable... after less than two decades. They didn't get special programs and reparations from anybody. They also didn't run around rioting and shouting "no justice no peace!" while destroying their own neighborhood, they didn't drink or use drugs, didn't break the law, my father in law didn't go have a bunch of other kids while he was trying to support the one he already had, and he made it a point to discipline his kid into having good morals and getting a good education.

Most black men out there couldn't give two shits about being an actual father to their own children. Is slavery to blame for that?

I have ancestors who came here poor from Italy. But they worked their way up, eventually owning a clothing factory.

Similar tales are to be told of many Caucasian immigrants...

If I believed in affirmative action, I'd say any white person that can trace ancestry to a slave should get the same benefits. That's besides the point, though. Blacks were stuck doing only cheap labor, because they were denied schooling or didn't have enough money for it and couldn't earn the skills that were required. White slaves had the same problem, and I'm sure if their were enough of them to make a statistic, the majority of their families wouldn't be doing much better then blacks are. Even if they were, they were white, so it was easier for them to cover up their previous enslavement. Blacks were clearly different, and physically had no way of escaping society's racism.

If you're saying that they're inferior because they couldn't work their way up from poverty, then the argument goes down to the classic "can poor people work their way out of poverty at all" discussion. Statistics show the answer. It happens with some blacks, but as generations move up the class latter, new generatiosn are created at the bottom. The same applies to whites, and many poor whites are in the same predicament. I wouldn't say whites are any better at escaping poverty then blacks are The only reason more blacks are poor is because more blacks started poor.

Just as many white men don't care about being fathers to their children. Alot of whites also drink and do drugs. Drug use is actually more common in the suburbs then anywhere else, and their are many white families I know that smoke crack and leave their kids that they can't suppor tto their own devices. Stop taking qualities that exist among certain humans in general and assigning them specifically to a race. Fucking and running is common among the lower classes, race has absolutely nothing to do with it.

I know nobody campaigned to give poor whites benefits, but that's not my argument. I'd be all for an affirmative action system targetting the lower classes regardless of race. I never advocated affirmative action in the first place, you're arguing against a point that nobody actually made. I'm simply saying that the poverty of blacks has nothing to do with their genetics or the inferiority of their culture. I'm not advocating reparations, so I don't see why you're arguing against them. I can't see a post in this thread where anyone advocated reparations? What are you getting at?

[This message has been edited by UnclNastyFingerz (edited 11-22-2002).]

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
I'm French.

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Ah, that explains a lot.

quote:

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If caucasions were in that situation at some point somewhere, what would they have done?

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I don't see much difference between being penniless on the county road, and being penniless on Ellis Island... except the results, generations later.

And your definition of "racialist" turns out to be wrong as well. It IS the politically correct successor to racist.

quote:

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U.K. racism: racism ( dated ) - MSN dictionary

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Who was offended by racist?

Edit: grammer, lol.

[This message has been edited by user X (edited 11-22-2002).]

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
I go to high school in New York, but I'm French. I'm a dual citizen, but I was born in France.

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All right, let's quit the crap. There is none of this "dual" citizenship nonsense. A little while ago you said you were not an American. So moron, now you are trying to have it both ways. YOUR OWN KEYBOARD WORDS SAID YOU ARE NOT AMERICAN. You DO NOT have dual citizenship...and those are your words.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
What did we do to slaves when we freed them?

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Who are "we" FROG. When I (Nox) use the word we, I am talking about Americans.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
Did we try to make them doctors and lawyers?

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No. Even the "we" Americans of 1865 really understood that someone who couldn't read or write probably wasn't the best candidate to be a doctor, let alone and ambulance chaser.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
If caucasions were in that situation at some point somewhere, what would they have done?

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And the poor, uneducated caucasians did exactly what they were supposed to do...they worked their way out of poverty.

Yet again, The 'Dual Citizen' FROG demonstrates his total lack of history of this country. Something tells me your knowledge of Frogland is even worse.

Nox

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Just as many white men don't care about being fathers to their children. Alot of whites also drink and do drugs.

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And if they're poor and do this, they stay poor, just like the blacks.

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Drug use is actually more common in the suburbs then anywhere else

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Do you have anything to back this up? Any proof at all? Based on my personal experience, that's total BS unless you're talking about shit like valium.

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I'm simply saying that the poverty of blacks has nothing to do with their genetics or the inferiority of their culture.

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Even if you deny the genetics arguement, it's pretty hard to squirm away from the culture. Even most people who are anti-racist use the "it's culture not race!" dodge. You deny that "fucking and running", rampant drug use, rampant alcoholism, total lack of scholastic ambition, total lack of discipline, and glorification of violence and criminal activity might have a little teensy weensy bit to do with why they're in a sorry state? You think spending hundreds of dollars on designer clothing and hair-dos while you're on welfare and have kids to support might have some effect on how your life and family are going to turn out?

I think the French have a liberal gene. They do this in Canada.

Liberal Gene? LOL.

Napoleon wasnt very Liberal...

[QUOTE]Originally posted by TheMouse
---------------------------------------------
[B]Whites have been enslaved. Whites have even been brought over to the US enslaved.
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No not really, and even if some have it was nothing compared to enslavement of blacks.

---------------------------------------------
No one ever went on some campaign to turn every white person into a doctor or lawyer.
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No one campaigned to turn blacks into doctors or lawyers either-they campaigned for equal rights in education. From the book Black civil rights in the USA 1954-1970 by Tony Murdoch "In 1954, for instance, the state of Mississippi was spending $98.15 per year for each white pupil and only $43.14 for each Negro student." This is why they were campaigning.

---------------------------------------------
Most white people have had tough lives and worked hard, and still do.
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Everyone who wants to make a decent living works hard these days, and i would have rather worked hard and been free than being a slave.

--------------------------------------------- Blacks picked cotton on a field and were fed, clothed, and sheltered for it.
---------------------------------------------
Yea, they also got raped, abused, insulted, humiliated and murdered (in every way imaginable).

--------------------------------------------- Many whites had to work long grueling hours at some factory or mine, didn't get clothed, fed, or sheltered by his boss, and was paid low wages.
---------------------------------------------
Life is tough.

---------------------------------------------
Many whites immigrated to US and Canada penniless, and no one campaigned to give them welfare benefits or free rides to collage.
---------------------------------------------
They weren't given anything because they CHOSE to migrate to Canada and the USA, Blacks were brought in on filthy ships against their will.

--------------------------------------------- My husband's family came to Canada as penniless refugees from Romania after the Soviets stole everything they had from them (they were filthy bourgeois pigs). Now, they're middle class and comfortable... after less than two decades. They didn't get special programs and reparations from anybody.
---------------------------------------------
Inspiring story...

--------------------------------------------- They also didn't run around rioting and shouting "no justice no peace!" while destroying their own neighborhood,
---------------------------------------------They also didn't get raped, killed and abused because of ther colour.

---------------------------------------------
they didn't drink or use drugs, didn't break the law, my father in law didn't go have a bunch of other kids while he was trying to support the one he already had, and he made it a point to discipline his kid into having good morals and getting a good education.
---------------------------------------------
That has nothing to do with race , it only proves that your husband is a good man. There are many good Blacks, Asians and Indians as well.

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Most black men out there couldn't give two shits about being an actual father to their own children. Is slavery to blame for that?
---------------------------------------------
That is a HUGE racist comment that is stereotyping black people as having no morals or ethics at all, very wrong, there are many white people that come from broken homes and do not know who their fathers are etc....

Mouse i totally disagree with your comments, I find it very wrong to judge people by their race, we should remember that black people in the USA are not all the way you describe them or think of them , there are many educated blacks who live good lives.

careful sic, they are bringing out the french frog calls now. If i were you I'd run.

twits.

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No not really, and even if some have it was nothing compared to enslavement of blacks.

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The Forgotten Slaves

quote:

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No one campaigned to turn blacks into doctors or lawyers either-they campaigned for equal rights in education. From the book Black civil rights in the USA 1954-1970 by Tony Murdoch "In 1954, for instance, the state of Mississippi was spending $98.15 per year for each white pupil and only $43.14 for each Negro student." This is why they were campaigning.

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We spend outrageous amounts of money on public schooling nowadays, and the quality has decreased. I think people need to learn that "money spent on a school does not equal good education". However, my comment was to Uncl, who claims that blacks aren't well off because after they were released no one tried to turn them into doctors or lawyers.

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Everyone who wants to make a decent living works hard these days, and i would have rather worked hard and been free than being a slave.

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No disagreement on that. The point was that whites weren't all just successful at birth. Their families worked very hard for generations, often under tough conditions.

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Yea, they also got raped, abused, insulted, humiliated and murdered (in every way imaginable).

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This did occur sometimes, but the exaggeration of it as a widespread practice makes no sense. Think about it. The slave is property to get work from. Why would someone pay a lot of money just to torture and murder a slave? That's damaging your own property, which you paid for.

Some lady did a book compiling memories of slavery by elderly blacks, and a great deal of them had good memories of their masters and slavery, and looked fondly back to the days where they had no responsibility and were taken care of. Of course, they were dismissed by the establishment as uncle and aunt Toms.

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Life is tough.

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No disagreement.

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They weren't given anything because they CHOSE to migrate to Canada and the USA, Blacks were brought in on filthy ships against their will.

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Dude, I'm not complaining because they weren't given anything. I'm pointing out that it's possible to be penniless and eventually work your way up to a decent life, provided you have the brains and willpower.

As for the blacks being brought against their will, I do think that after slavery was abolished they should have been repatriated to Liberia to live back in their motherland under black rule. Either that, or they shouldn't have been brought over in the first place.

quote:

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They also didn't get raped, killed and abused because of ther colour.

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Do you really think every black person got raped, killed, and abused because of their color? Black men rape white women far more than the reverse. Black men disproportionately murder white people. Many whites were lynched along with blacks. It wasn't a black only thing.

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That has nothing to do with race , it only proves that your husband is a good man. There are many good Blacks, Asians and Indians as well.

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You don't have to convince me that their are many good Asians, since I live near a lot of Asians and most of them 1) work hard 2) have nuclear families with high-investment parenting 3) care about education, and 4) obey the law. As a result, is it really suprising that the place I'm living in now isn't a crime-filled ghetto? Switch all the asian immigrants here with East LA, and it would be.

What my point proves, is that culture and attitude matters a great deal, and that the failures of blacks can't be blamed on "oppression" any more.

quote:

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That is a HUGE racist comment that is stereotyping black people as having no morals or ethics at all, very wrong, there are many white people that come from broken homes and do not know who their fathers are etc....

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The black illegitimacy rate hovers around 70%. Yes, there are many white men who are irresponsible, but is it around 70 percent of them?

When I listen to the ravings of Spirit or SaturnRocket, it really makes me ashamed to be human.

You are the lowest form of life. Specifically, anyone who sits around trying to figure out why other people are to blame for the problems of the world are the lowest forms of life. The fact that you have chosen those people with different skin color makes you blind to the stupidity of all people, black, white, yellow, whatever.

The fact that you are debating it when the underlying premise is FALSE, just means you are morons.

I hope anyone reading these posts can see that for themselves.

J.C. Stanton

Oh yeah, and anyone who points to racist propaganda to support their point(like the Mouse has) is just desperate.

J.C. Stanton

Factual rebuttals?

quote:

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Originally posted by J.C. Stanton:
Specifically, anyone who sits around trying to figure out why other people are to blame for the problems of the world are the lowest forms of life. The fact that you have chosen those people with different skin color makes you blind to the stupidity of all people, black, white, yellow, whatever.

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This is ironic, since what most of us are arguing against is the premise that white people are to blame for the failures of "people of color".

I say I'm not American because I wasn't born in America, and was originally a French citizen. I achieved dual citizenship early in my life, and since I'm American on my mother's side, I'll say "we" to refer to the action of some of my ancestors. The frog thing only makes you look stupid and cover up any sort of intelligent point you're making.

"fucking and running, rampant drug use, rampant alcoholism, total lack of scholastic ambition, total lack of discipline, and glorification of violence and criminal activity" - these are traits of poverty. Poor whites, poor blacks, poor Mexicans - these qualities exist in poor communities, accept glorification of violence. The majority of black people in the ghetto I know are horrified by their lifestyle and would do anything to escape from it.

Comparing blacks to the immigrants from Ellis Island doesn't work because the contexts were completely different. Immigrants came from Ellis island with an intact culture, and their were so many of them that they could gather together and establish themselves.

Blacks were freed with their culture completely destroyed. They were victims of legal, institutionalized racism. There was descrimination against immigrants from western europe, but it wasn't government sanctioned. The poverty of blacks in south was also considerably worse then the majority of immigrants from Europe. Add a butchered culture, extreme poverty, and legal segregation that blocked their only road out, and what you get is despair. Are you gonna tell me the Jim Crow laws didn't affect black people at all?

btw, Napoleon wasn't French.

[This message has been edited by UnclNastyFingerz (edited 11-22-2002).]

Don't put Spirit and Saturn in the same catagory...

quote:

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Napoleon doesn't seem very liberal...

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Napoleon was Corsican. Corsica, while technically part of France, is Italian. Corsican nationalists even blew up a french official there last year.

At the time of Napoleon, Corsica was officially part of Italy. Napolean spoke French with a thick Italien accent.

As for the drugs in the suburbs, I'll find some official statistic. Until then, I can hold you off with saying that I was in rehab in New York City, and the majority of patients were white people from the suburbs addicted to either cocaine or heroin. About 15% of the patients I saw were black, and most blacks were hooked on crack cocaine and lived in the projects. That isn't much proof, but I've read the statistic somehere and will find it shortly.

[This message has been edited by UnclNastyFingerz (edited 11-22-2002).]

Has anyone else got the impression that the inferiority of blacks is precisely because of the advocation of "affirmative action". History is affected more by the actions of individuals than is realised, and just as Luther King may have moved blacks forwards by leading the case for equal rights, the individuals who have created the culture of blame which means that ethnic minorities can claim that historical factors exempt their groups from responsibility and progression set their group back sevseral generations.

Forget supposed notions of genetic superiority for a moment, and just think: if you were black, and told that your failures were down to white failures, would you be inclined to work harder?

Just as the voiciferous minority leaders strived to achieve equality; now they push too far and weaken their people with false excuses.

quote:

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"fucking and running, rampant drug use, rampant alcoholism, total lack of scholastic ambition, total lack of discipline, and glorification of violence and criminal activity" - these are traits of poverty. Poor whites, poor blacks, poor Mexicans - these qualities exist in poor communities, accept glorification of violence. The majority of black people in the ghetto I know are horrified by their lifestyle and would do anything to escape from it.

---

1) Impovershed rural whites do not have that same culture as inner city hoodlums.

2) Have you ever considered that their culture is to blame for their poverty instead of the other way around? You seem to think that if we just handed them a bunch of money, they'd turn into middle class soccer moms.

quote:

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Comparing blacks to the immigrants from Ellis Island doesn't work because the contexts were completely different. Immigrants came from Ellis island with an intact culture, and their were so many of them that they could gather together and establish themselves.

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1) Yes, the immigrants had a good culture most of the time.

2) There are a great deal of blacks who could get together and establish themselves. However, when they get together nowadays it seems like it's always for the purpose of "blaming whitey and trying to get a shakedown", rioting, or joining a gang.

quote:

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Blacks were freed with their culture completely destroyed. They were victims of legal, institutionalized racism. There was descrimination against immigrants from western europe, but it wasn't government sanctioned. The poverty of blacks in south was also considerably worse then the majority of immigrants from Europe. Add a butchered culture, extreme poverty, and legal segregation that blocked their only road out, and what you get is despair. Are you gonna tell me the Jim Crow laws didn't affect black people at all?

---

None of which exists any more, and they even get added perks nowadays. 50 years from now, if blacks are in the same state they are today, people like you will still be blaming white people from centuries ago. By the way, legel segregation didn't "block their only way out". They were allowed to start black businesses, have black schools, etc.

So, no. The Jim Crow laws have no effect on any blacks today. They don't exist any more.

Affirmative action would have been useful before the civil rights movement. Since all that's past, it's unneccesary and probably detrimental to the black community.

Here's something about drugs in the suburbs. http://www.s-t.com/daily/03-99/03-01-99/a01lo011.htm

quote:

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Originally posted by FuckOffandDie:
Has anyone else got the impression that the inferiority of blacks is precisely because of the advocation of "affirmative action". History is affected more by the actions of individuals than is realised, and just as Luther King may have moved blacks forwards by leading the case for equal rights, the individuals who have created the culture of blame which means that ethnic minorities can claim that historical factors exempt their groups from responsibility and progression set their group back sevseral generations.

Forget supposed notions of genetic superiority for a moment, and just think: if you were black, and told that your failures were down to white failures, would you be inclined to work harder?

Just as the voiciferous minority leaders strived to achieve equality; now they push too far and weaken their people with false excuses.

---

This is a very large piece of the puzzle about American blacks which liberals fail to look at because it places the blame on themselves instead of the constant pointing at the "evil white conservative men".

It doesn't explain the poor behavior of blacks in other countries, but it's a valid observation regarding the ones in America.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
Affirmative action would have been useful before the civil rights movement. Since all that's past, it's unneccesary and probably detrimental to the black community.

Here's something about drugs in the suburbs. http://www.s-t.com/daily/03-99/03-01-99/a01lo011.htm

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Yes, there are drugs in some suburbs. The drugs are spilling out from the city to the suburbs. That doesn't go along with your original hypothesis, which is that most crack users are suburban whites.

Drugs generally come from cities, no argument there. The users are mostly suburban, that's all I'm saying. Poor people on the street obviously distribute it, why the fuck would someone with enough money to get through college and get a well paid job risk their futures distributing drugs? In that case I'm referring to cocaine, heroin, and crack cocaine.

Some drugs are primarily suburban - sold in the suburbs, used in the suburbs. Ecstasy, Ketamine, MDA, LSD, LSA, Crystal Meth - the markets are most concentrated in the richest neighborhoods of the richest suburbs. Even marijuana is just as common in the suburbs as in the city.

My maine point is that the majority of drug problems involving users, not dealers, occur in the suburbs. Definately more cocaine addicts, a bit more heroin and crack addicts, more meth addicts, and about the same number of alcoholics. Drug abuse is a nationwide problem. The only aspect of it that can be traced specifically to the inner city is the core of crack and meth distribution. Overdoses, addictions, and deaths are if anything more suburban.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
I say I'm not American because I wasn't born in America, and was originally a French citizen. I achieved dual citizenship early in my life, and since I'm American on my mother's side, I'll say "we" to refer to the action of some of my ancestors. The frog thing only makes you look stupid and cover up any sort of intelligent point you're making.

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Here you go again. Both sides of your mouth. You claim you are not an American and now you claim you are. Stupid? Moi? In your case MORON is appropo. And as usual, it is you who avoids the point. FROG? You are the one who claimed that and it is not a case of me placing the title on you.

Nox

quote:

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Originally posted by J.C. Stanton:

You are the lowest form of life. Specifically, anyone who sits around trying to figure out why other people are to blame for the problems of the world are the lowest forms of life.

J.C. Stanton

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As mouse did point out, this [/is] ironic, as we are trying to say we are not the source of their problems.

quote:

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Originally posted by J.C. Stanton:
...anyone who sits around trying to figure out why other people are to blame for the problems of the world are the lowest forms of life.

---

Should we stop blaming John Ashcroft for usurping our liberties? Or failed corporate leadership? No? I didn't think so...
___

Uncl, how would slavery steal a man's culture?

And I'm curious, if anybody knows, what was the general disposition of slaves receiving their freedom? Did they stay and start getting paid? or did they get booted off of the plantation?

Also, would Zimbabwean farmland be a suitable reparation payment? Zimbabwe boasts a fertility rate of 3.2, HIV rate of 25%, and a literacy rate of 85%. If they were restored to their lost culture, it shouldn't take them long to get caught up with all the latest advancements.

IfJust because laws don't exist today doesn't mean they have continuing affects on people. If someone takes you away from your family, takes everything you own, and released you with nothing, you're still feeling the affects.

Poor rural whites don't have the same problems as urban blacks. Rural blacks don't suffer those problems. The qualities you mention are urban. Poor urban whites deal with the same thing.

I blame poverty for their culture and not vice versa because impoverished whites also adapt that culture, and middle class blacks don't. The traits are common to poor urban communities, not black people.

What amazes me about racists is the "let bigones be bigones" attitude towards slavery and segregation. If you rob someone of their freedom for centuries, and release them into a world where they're barely legally human, and finally do away with the laws, the lasting affect is still there.

Heh. The only pre-caucasian settlement in Zimbabwe is an Indian/Egyptian port city.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by TheMouse:
------------------------------------------[B] The black illegitimacy rate hovers around 70%. Yes, there are many white men who are irresponsible, but is it around 70 percent of them.
---------------------------------------------
Is this in the US or Africa?
And poverty of any people will lead to an increase in illegitimacy rates.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by TheMouse:
---------------------------------------------
So, no. The Jim Crow laws have no effect on any blacks today. They don't exist any more.
---------------------------------------------
How can you say that?
emotional scars of how their families were treated in the past will always be there and will lead to continuing anger.

quote:

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If someone takes you away from your family, takes everything you own, and released you with nothing, you're still feeling the affects.

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Well, that's pretty fucking strange, because the Soviets took everything away from my husband's family and they aren't stewing about with any emotional effects or trauma. They hopped back into the middle class in less than a couple decades.

quote:

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If you rob someone of their freedom for centuries, and release them into a world where they're barely legally human, and finally do away with the laws, the lasting affect is still there.

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The black people today were never enslaved, and have grown up with affirmative action, BET, hip hop, MTV, and welfare, not Jim Crow and the KKK

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Is this in the US or Africa?

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US

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How can you say that?
emotional scars of how their families were treated in the past will always be there and will lead to continuing anger.

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No, they won't, because they never experienced it. The only way the "scars" last is when goofy ass liberals and race pimps keep feeding that manufactured anger with endless "the white man keeps you down" propaganda as a way to shakedown and blame "whitey" and "The Man" instead of changing their own attitudes.

30 blacks, angered and hurt by Jim Crow laws, strike back at whitey by stealing beer, cigarrettes, shelf of food from quikie mart after Hip Hop concert

Impovershed, desperate blacks, suffering from 'Post Traumatic Slavery Disorder' strike a blow against white privilege in Harvard

Don't listen to what this guy just posted. By "affects" I don't mean it makes them really sad. It's not emotional at all, it's financial.

And your husband's family didn't come to a country where the government imposed legal segregation on them. No governmen or racist culture denied them jobs or education. Black people have been victims or segregation and extreme poverty. Modern blacks haven't dealt with Jim Crow, but their parents did. I suppose it's their fault they were born in the projects? Is it their fault their parents were denied a college education because of their skin color?

There's been much more racial violence against blacks by whites then vice versa. It's a two way straight, and if you're gona accuse liberals of acting like it isn't, you shouldn't do the exact same thing.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
What amazes me about racists is the "let bigones be bigones" attitude...

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So, at what age did you learn English? I chuckled the first time you did this, but now I'm beginning to think it's some kind of Fruedian slippage, related to average black cock stats.

quote:

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towards slavery and segregation. If you rob someone of their freedom for centuries, and release them into a world where they're barely legally human, and finally do away with the laws, the lasting affect is still there.

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Some of us think, that after welfare, affirmative action, free education and seven generations of freedom, that this "effect" no longer exists. And you didn't answer my question Uncl.
___

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMouse:
...the Soviets took everything away from my husband's family...

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What's the story here? Was he a Soviet citizen?

quote:

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Originally posted by FuckOffandDie:
Has anyone else got the impression that the inferiority of blacks is precisely because of the advocation of "affirmative action".

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Uh, blacks aren't inferior.

J.C. Stanton
jcstanton at totse dot com

quote:

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Originally posted by user X:
What's the story here? Was he a Soviet citizen?

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They were Romanian citizens. Soviets took over Romania.

quote:

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Originally posted by UnclNastyFingerz:
And your husband's family didn't come to a country where the government imposed legal segregation on them. No governmen or racist culture denied them jobs or education.

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No, they just took away all of their property because they were "bourgeois scum", so they came to Canada as penniless refugees and became middle class again in less than a couple decades. No racial preferances, no special programs, just work, schooling, and wise/frugal use of money gotten.

I guess they could have just sat around and blamed their poverty on commies, but they decided to do stuff for themselves instead.

In WWII ? how old is this guy?

let's summerize jc stanton's arguments and his support:

"racism is bad.....because i said so."

"blacks aren't inferior........because i said so."

Nothing like being educated about race through TV and public schools. If you want to cry over something, how about your lack of foresight.

I'm guessing the Canadian government didn't deny them the right to go to a decent school, the right to vote, and the ability to get the amjority of jobs they'd like.

If the government did do that, they probably wouldn't ended up in a different situation.

No, this was after WWII. They couldn't come to Canada right away, and they came when he was like 4 yrs old. It was around the 70's that they finally got to move out I think. His dad and grandma remember more than he does.

quote:

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I'm guessing the Canadian government didn't deny them the right to go to a decent school, the right to vote, and the ability to get the amjority of jobs they'd like.

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Guess what. Several decades ago, things in the US changed, and blacks were given the right to go "decent schools", the right to vote, and the ability to get jobs they want, even if they're less qualified than a white applicant.

I'm not getting it, my inbox is probably full. Try again, maybe it would work now.

I don't fucking "get it" either. It would have been just as easy to send the answer to my e-mail box (listed here since day one), than to make a new post - in which you ask me to ask again.

I sent it anyway, lol.

[1 day later... still no answer.]

Don't make me spam you boy!

I answered dammit.

*Having NOT received the aforementioned reply, and not being interested in getting into a public pissing contest with Uncl: decides to seek his reply via e-mail*

UserX,

I hate the thought of loosing a good Totse member so do me a favor please ... Don't hold your breath waiting for that email.

Nox