I recall being younger, and more naive. I had this idea that nice guys lose and assholes win. I read up on this. There were many ideas out there to explain this phenomenon. They related to assertiveness, confidence, and all this other load of crap that was, well, a load of crap. Ladder Theory ring a bell? It's bullshit.

You see, romance works kind of like this: Opposites do not attract.

If you are a piece of shit, you will attract pieces of shit.
If you are a nice man, you'll attract nice ladies.
If you are a mean spirited shithead, you will attract evil cunts.
If you are a good guy, you will attract good girls.

I know, novel idea, isn't it?

Do you want to jump from woman to woman leaving behind confusion and disease? You'll attract women who want the same.

Do you want to be a kind and loving man capable of supporting those he loves with an insistence on enjoying the bountiful life available to us all? You'll attract women who want the same.

Really, think about it. Is a good natured woman with the means to support her loved ones and a playful heart going to be attracted to a manwhore that just wants to use her? NO! She wants a man that also has a good, playful heart and the motivation to really do something good in this world!

We attract what we are. Not only in relationships, but in all areas of life. Be we trouble, we find trouble. Be we peace, we find peace. Be we love, we find love.

The personality you want life to treat you with is the one you have to work towards within your self. Mind you, life is much bigger than romance.

I really like to see this kind of pluck. I consider myself a nice guy, despite what some people might say, and I get girls. I don't know what I think about your opposites theory but I like the general gist.

In most scenarios, I would agree with you.

Good point. But have you ever considered all of those abusive relationships all those "nice" girls are in?

I'm begining to think all these fucking women out there have this little disorder, a disorder to please. If you treat a woman like crap, she'll want you oh so much. But as soon as you treat her like she deserves to be treated, she'll spit right back in your face.

Nice guys don't finish last at all. The problem is that they don't find a "nice" girl. There's very few of them around.

You sound like one of those people who is all about positivity, and I hate to ruin your parade so don't get me wrong; you never get back what you give. People are people, people are good bad, whatever. At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter. In the end its all about the ego-drive. No matter how positive you are, how good you are; thinking you will get back the same thing you put out simply isnt true.

Look around, look at all the failed relationships out there. Look at the divorce rates. It's all a big joke.
People change, you'll change, she'll change. And nice wont be nice anymore. You'll need something now. But assholes, they seem to be less predictable, and thats what gives them an advantage. People want to please others, assholes are abit harder to please. Hence ego-drive makes them more attractive.

Who would you rather have a half-way decent girl or someone totally out of your game? You'd always try for the latter before going for the former.

The problem is that they don't find a "nice" girl. There's very few of them around.

Oh fuck off, there are more than you'll ever realize. Women are confusing as fuck, but amazing, and it's much easier to claim they're a pack of cheating cunts than it is to try and figure them out. Every loser who never gets the girl claims she was a bitch and he was a nice guy. Realistically, the nice guys only hate the 'jocks/cocky' guys because they're better looking and less socially retarded.

At the end of the day, all this crap is bullshit. Every single bit of it. "Friends zone"? Fucking start generating some attraction, start flirting and give off the vibe of a confident guy rather than the creepy pedophile-rapist auras all the 'nice guys' here give off.

Any way, only stupid bitches are attracted to ass holes. Luckily they're both the minority. You hear and see these relationships and they'll stand out and you'll remember them. Little did you know the other 40 couples you saw that day were actually really happy.

[/rant]

Good point. But have you ever considered all of those abusive relationships all those "nice" girls are in?

Passive self loathing qualifies as nice to you? Letting your self be beaten by a piece of shit just for your fix of attention and heartless apologies afterwards qualifies as nice? Since when was being a door mat a trait of nice? Nice is empathy, warmth, caring...not laying down and letting the world rape your soul.

I'm begining to think all these fucking women out there have this little disorder, a disorder to please. If you treat a woman like crap, she'll want you oh so much. But as soon as you treat her like she deserves to be treated, she'll spit right back in your face.

Yeah, that definitely falls into the definition of 'evil cunt'...not that she's really evil, or even a cunt. It's all learned behaviors, learned coping skills, learned traits of thought and action.

Nice guys don't finish last at all. The problem is that they don't find a "nice" girl. There's very few of them around.

That's not true at all. Many guys think they are nice that aren't at all...many of my brothers don't even want a relationship, they want property they can treat nice to prove they're not the asshole that beats his wife. It's much how the abused woman labels her self a victim to justify her own inaction; she says she loves him, and turns the other cheek, and forgives him, when all she is really after is the only kind of attention she knows how to garner...it's a complete delusion used to enforce faulty patterns of behavior that the individual knows deep down are wrong and broken.

You sound like one of those people who is all about positivity, and I hate to ruin your parade so don't get me wrong; you never get back what you give. People are people, people are good bad, whatever. At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter. In the end its all about the ego-drive. No matter how positive you are, how good you are; thinking you will get back the same thing you put out simply isnt true.

True, you get a tremendous amount more than you could ever put in. You see, for the past two years, I have tried to give more back to life than I take from it, and as screwed as this is, I can't even begin to keep up with giving away what I'm given. You have a broke mindset...you have no idea how much life gives each and every one of us. Life gives me emotion, feeling, breathe, potential, love, joy, laughter, friends, family...and all I can give back are stories of my own life and a bit of my material possessions. It is absolutely impossible for someone to give back more than they receive, no matter how hard they try.

Look around, look at all the failed relationships out there. Look at the divorce rates. It's all a big joke.
People change, you'll change, she'll change. And nice wont be nice anymore. You'll need something now. But assholes, they seem to be less predictable, and thats what gives them an advantage. People want to please others, assholes are abit harder to please. Hence ego-drive makes them more attractive.

Call me a lunatic if you wish, but this is the greatest proof of God I have seen outside of my own experience: Couples who focus on growing closer to God end up growing closer together over time. Those without any form of spirituality end up chasing material goods and grow apart in pursuit of fleshly desires.

Who would you rather have a half-way decent girl or someone totally out of your game? You'd always try for the latter before going for the former.

Game? I don't have game. I don't play. I don't act. I'm me. See, you have game, so you attract women with game. Game guarantees failure because it makes the relationship about toying with someone's head instead of growing together. Quit playing games and you won't get played either...game is transparent when you're not stuck in your own virtual world of delusional rules.

You want something real? Be real and life gets real with you. Life respects who and what we are; God designed it that way.

I think someone needs to define a "nice guy". Same goes with "asshole", they're both just generalized terms.

Everyone you know has someone who thinks they're an asshole and someone who thinks they're nice.

Firstly, great post. It's a nice change to see something like this pop up ever now and the.


Passive self loathing qualifies as nice to you? Letting your self be beaten by a piece of shit just for your fix of attention and heartless apologies afterwards qualifies as nice? Since when was being a door mat a trait of nice? Nice is empathy, warmth, caring...not laying down and letting the world rape your soul.
Agreed.

Yeah, that definitely falls into the definition of 'evil cunt'...not that she's really evil, or even a cunt. It's all learned behaviors, learned coping skills, learned traits of thought and action.
Unofrtunately, from where I am, thats what I see.
It's all the traits they pick up, that they pick up from the society around them. But such is human nature. We tend to be like others around us. And if there is crap all around us, how could we possibly expect anything else?
I guess that's a fault of mine, for being in a bad "place", emotionally and physically.



That's not true at all. Many guys think they are nice that aren't at all...many of my brothers don't even want a relationship, they want property they can treat nice to prove they're not the asshole that beats his wife. It's much how the abused woman labels her self a victim to justify her own inaction; she says she loves him, and turns the other cheek, and forgives him, when all she is really after is the only kind of attention she knows how to garner...it's a complete delusion used to enforce faulty patterns of behavior that the individual knows deep down are wrong and broken.

Once again, I agree.


Game? I don't have game. I don't play. I don't act. I'm me.
And thats the biggest problem I have come across. The fact that people pretend to be something they are completely not. They act in a way they think will please anything. Too few people are true to themselves, again this is human nature, but I think it is the biggest problem. If people were true to themselves, everything would go alot smother. But to me atleast, it always seems a game.

Too many people are playing it, and most of them don't even
know they are playing.


You want something real? Be real and life gets real with you. Life respects who and what we are; God designed it that way.

:)

Game? I don't have game. I don't play. I don't act. I'm me. See, you have game, so you attract women with game. Game guarantees failure because it makes the relationship about toying with someone's head instead of growing together. Quit playing games and you won't get played either...game is transparent when you're not stuck in your own virtual world of delusional rules.

You want something real? Be real and life gets real with you. Life respects who and what we are; God designed it that way.


Everyone has game. Your game is to be a self righteous, god lover.

Nice guy - Empathic, honest, caring, trusting, open
Asshole - Cold, deceitful, selfish, controlling

Obviously, most people aren't completely polarized to one extreme. For example, God granted me empathy, honesty, affection, and faith, but it can take me long periods of time to open up my entire personality and life experience to someone.

And yes, I do know folks who think I'm an asshole. That's okay though, because every person I have let really get to know me in the past few years has told me I have a good heart and a good mind. I thank God for that, because I wasn't 'good' before then.

Everyone has game. Your game is to be a self righteous, god lover.

You want to know my ego? Here, I'll describe it to you: It's completely narcissistic, has no faith in anything, yearns for death, thinks the government is out to kill it, is so filled with lust that it became addicted to child pornography, is obsessed with drugs and alcohol, is obsessed with prostitutes to the point of attempting to rape one, is so obsessed with itself that no love for another human being could get in the way of what it wants, has no problem with physical hurting people, revels in emotionally damaging people...hell, I could go on for much longer describing what *I*, that is, my ego, is. You think I think I am righteous? BLIND MAN, GOD IS RIGHTEOUS BECAUSE BY HIS GRACE ALONE I DO NOT HAVE TO LIVE IN THE AGONIZING HELL THAT IS MY EGO, BY HIS GRACE ALONE AM I FREE FROM THE BONDAGE OF THAT MONSTER, BY HIS GRACE ALONE HAS MY LIFE BEEN RAISED FROM SLEEPING ON GRAVEL FACING LIVER FAILURE WITH A CONSCIENCE EATING MY MIND AWAY AND YEARNING FOR DEATH'S SWEET EMBRACE TO WHAT IT IS TODAY!

I know my self is not righteous, and I thank God every single morning and every single night that my self is no longer even a part of my thoughts, feelings, and actions today.

You want to know my ego? Here, I'll describe it to you: It's completely narcissistic, has no faith in anything, yearns for death, thinks the government is out to kill it, is so filled with lust that it became addicted to child pornography, is obsessed with drugs and alcohol, is obsessed with prostitutes to the point of attempting to rape one, is so obsessed with itself that no love for another human being could get in the way of what it wants, has no problem with physical hurting people, revels in emotionally damaging people...hell, I could go on for much longer describing what *I*, that is, my ego, is. You think I think I am righteous? BLIND MAN, GOD IS RIGHTEOUS BECAUSE BY HIS GRACE ALONE I DO NOT HAVE TO LIVE IN THE AGONIZING HELL THAT IS MY EGO, BY HIS GRACE ALONE AM I FREE FROM THE BONDAGE OF THAT MONSTER, BY HIS GRACE ALONE HAS MY LIFE BEEN RAISED FROM SLEEPING ON GRAVEL FACING LIVER FAILURE WITH A CONSCIENCE EATING MY MIND AWAY AND YEARNING FOR DEATH'S SWEET EMBRACE TO WHAT IT IS TODAY!

I know my self is not righteous, and I thank God every single morning and every single night that my self is no longer even a part of my thoughts, feelings, and actions today.

Ok then...

thread poster, i don't agree with you, i'm an asshole and i get nice girls

But i don't play games, me is me, and i do show respect, cause respect and honesty is everything, but there's simply no denyin i'm far from a nice guy

But it works cause girls think it makes for intresting relationship and they think they can change me.

Sadly for them they are only right on one of the two

Not saying nice guys don't finish first sometimes too. But your view on the world is too optimistic

If they're trying to change who you are, wouldn't that make them manipulative (on top of not accepting you for who you are), and thus fitting the definition I put forward for 'asshole'?

OP, you are retarded. Not because of the premise of your thread, though partially because of it.

If you say that you're not playing a game then how can nice guys "win?"

"Nice" guys might get lucky sometimes, and arseholes win sometimes too. Your point about being yourself is about the only valid one, and it sort of negates the others. Because you talk about being a nice guy, but what if being yourself means you're a complete arsehole? Does that mean that someone should change themselves just so that they can be a "nice" guy?

You're quite clearly a troll from your half-caps post. Either a troll or the most retarded human being I've ever encountered. You decide.

I agree with OP
case in point; myself.
Im a good guy or a nice guy, however you look at it, and thats exactly what i got in a girlfriend.

Oh well, if there's one example of it, it must be proof. Scientific method ftw.

Giving someone the real you is about the most sincere and genuine display of honesty, caring, openness, and trust that there is. Dropping your guard so much as to let someone see your weaknesses requires trust. Not hiding your mistakes is a display of honesty. Giving someone the real you instead of toying with their head trying to create a certain impression shows a great deal of caring for them. Sharing who you really are, in word and in action, requires openness. That is a real good one, and they only attract real good ones.

Contrarily, you can lie about who you are. You can let someone down time and time again because they don't know you and expect you to live up to the fake image you declare yourself as. You can be so afraid of someone seeing you as you are, scared. You can close yourself off from their love and likewise give none to them. You can hurt them, you can try to make them live how you think they must, you can abuse them. That is a real asshole, and they only attract real assholes.

*I used the term 'win' in the thread title in relationship to the 'nice guys lose, assholes win' delusion of my younger days.*

But what if you really are the kind of arsehole who loves beating women? Should you be yourself? That's my question, because that's what what you're saying implies. That it's okay to be who you are as long as you're honest. What if you dig down real deep and find that you love raping little kiddies? What if you love getting girls pregnant just to force them to get abortions? Your system can justify anything, so long as you remain true to yourself.

I was really expecting a "I'm a nice guy and I got a girl over a tattooed loud-mouthed prick so there!" thread!

To a certain extent I agree with you...You attract what you are. I be nice, loving and caring and I get the same. I be a single, uncaring, dirty bastard and I get just that.
The only thing I disagree with is being who you are. People can be who they want to be.

I've been the nice, caring and sweet guy and got absolutely nothing while my hairy, loud-mouthed arsehole brother got all the pussy...I've been the bad mother fucker who got shit for being too tough.
One must adjust their behaviour to the situation and person in front of them.
If all you want is a fuck, play to the girl...Play how you want her to perceive you and you'll do okay with some practice. Be the nice guy to a girl who just wants a fuck and you're only going to fuck your hand.

When the time is right and you want to pursue something worthwhile with a girl, be yourself and wait for the right one. You may have to wait a while but when she comes along, you'll not look back.

The thing you should have said is that pussies get no pussy, its the only rule out there. If you want a girl, go for it.

You want something real? Be real and life gets real with you. Life respects who and what we are; God designed it that way.

Your post made me smile :)

QUICK:

http://super-genius.org/images/wambulance.jpg

I haven't slipped towards spirituality, but I've seen this situation time and time again. It truly seems to be a positive thing.

If they're trying to change who you are, wouldn't that make them manipulative (on top of not accepting you for who you are), and thus fitting the definition I put forward for 'asshole'?

No. There's a difference between manipulative, and openly saying, well... i would appreciate if you didn't do it again.

I liked this thread until God came into it.

just be awesome, and things will fall into your lap. it's simple, but it ain't easy. Lazarus.

Lol god may have not come into it.....but a concept of philosophy and religion have been here since the OP's first post. I do enjoy his very ZEN/TAOism view on relationships.......and in a sense i agree.

However sometimes we need to experience the good with the bad. So that humans can get a feel for what they really want, and what to avoid. Nice girls could be attracted to women beaters, and assholes, perhaps just getting them in the right mindset to look for nice guys.

As scattered throughout various threads......women of 35+ are very open with what guys they date. It could be the fattest, ugliest, baldest mother fucker on the planet. If a guy treats her right she will give him a shot. Girls are granted being picky with men early in life, but that will fade. Later on in life its us guys who have all the choices in the world. The question wont be which women we should be trying to find. The question will be which girl SHOULDNT i date, due to emotional baggage, and her fear of choosing anyone cause she doesnt wanna die alone.

Thank god for the OP. It's about time someone pulled their head out of their ass.

I shall refer to this thread whenever some idiot claims that being an asshole is the only way to get girls.

Seriously OP stfu about all that God bullshit, no reason to blame your happy life on anything but yourself.

Seriously I did god(who took the form of a girl) up the ass last night and made her suck me dry while I spanked her with a fly swatter.

while I spanked her with a fly swatter.

IM not one to judge......but a fly swatter? There had to be something more appealing/attractive near by then that! You were spanking her w/ dead fly guts. Sicko

IM not one to judge......but a fly swatter? There had to be something more appealing/attractive near by then that! You were spanking her w/ dead fly guts. Sicko

That was gods idea, not mine. Apparently she likes it nasty style.

Oh fuck off, there are more than you'll ever realize. Women are confusing as fuck, but amazing, and it's much easier to claim they're a pack of cheating cunts than it is to try and figure them out. Every loser who never gets the girl claims she was a bitch and he was a nice guy. Realistically, the nice guys only hate the 'jocks/cocky' guys because they're better looking and less socially retarded.

At the end of the day, all this crap is bullshit. Every single bit of it. "Friends zone"? Fucking start generating some attraction, start flirting and give off the vibe of a confident guy rather than the creepy pedophile-rapist auras all the 'nice guys' here give off.

Any way, only stupid bitches are attracted to ass holes. Luckily they're both the minority. You hear and see these relationships and they'll stand out and you'll remember them. Little did you know the other 40 couples you saw that day were actually really happy.

[/rant]

I agree, good post. Women are confusing, but not impossible to figure out. Granted it also depends on the woman, and some are very difficult to keep up with and require a lot of tenacity to stand on even footing with them. Others are a bit more transparent. But those women also tend to be more boring, IMO. A part of me enjoys the whole female emotional instanity thing, as long as it's not with the associated harpy-ish shrill bitching and claws.

And agreed also with the jocks thing. As a whole, or a 'group', I've never had a problem with them. Granted there are always some that think they're the shit because they're good at sports or whatever and sports is the centre of their life... and contrary to popular opinion, I really couldn't give a shit. Those I tend to not be too fond of, but that has nothing to do with girls and dating. That has to do with the invidual just being an asshole. If a girl wants to see an asshole over me, I don't consider it a loss. I'm glad she's just shown to me that she's not worth my time.

And to be honest, I've never understood the 'friends zone' thing. I've befriended lots of girls, and many of them ended up wanting something more. Not all, of course, or anywhere near that number... but a surprisingly large chunk, all the same. Infact, doing the whole 'friends' thing, even if only for a moment, at the initial part, seems to actually work pretty well for me. Maybe that's because I'm just not the most outgoing type, but once they get to talking with me, they realize I'm not a creep and have a sizable well of self-confidence; and am actually pretty charming and interesting, or whatever, once you begin talking with me about something.

There are a lot of happy couples. I think a lot of people just have to accept, that the way they are now, women can't be blamed for not wanting to date them. Creepyness and lack of confidence, from the female perspective, is one of the big turn offs. And from an evolutionary psychology perspective, I'd say it makes sense. They'd want someone who would actually be able to perform properly without tripping over self doubt all the time. Competence is hot. As soon as I started looking to myself for fulfillment, and stopped caring what others thought, a lot of people seemed to suddenly become interested in me. And I no longer made any effort to change my personality for other people, beyond the level of just common courtesy, so interracting with others simultaneously became a lot easier, as well.

But what if you really are the kind of arsehole who loves beating women? Should you be yourself? That's my question, because that's what what you're saying implies. That it's okay to be who you are as long as you're honest. What if you dig down real deep and find that you love raping little kiddies? What if you love getting girls pregnant just to force them to get abortions? Your system can justify anything, so long as you remain true to yourself.

My system doesn't justify a thing. Neither does your skepticism, by the way, so while your relationships continue to be either non existent or complete crap, keep that in mind. You aren't willing to try something else? That's fine with me.

No. There's a difference between manipulative, and openly saying, well... i would appreciate if you didn't do it again.

Oh, well then she isn't even trying to change you, she's letting her feelings be known. Ya know, part of that whole sharing who you are with someone deal.

Perhaps she sees something in you that you yourself haven't noticed yet?

Seriously OP stfu about all that God bullshit, no reason to blame your happy life on anything but yourself.

Seriously I did god(who took the form of a girl) up the ass last night and made her suck me dry while I spanked her with a fly swatter.

I will not silence my faith, nor apologize for it. If you don't like that my entire life is centered around my relationship with God, then stay out of my threads, because my faith will be present in every last one I post.

---------------------

To those of you who appreciated or got something from this thread, I'm glad.

. If you don't like that my entire life is centered around my relationship with God, then stay out of my threads, because my faith will be present in every last one I post.

While it's not really my say, that seems a bit excessive. What if your post is completely unrelated to theology or spirituality? Would you just try to work it in somehow?

I don't have a problem with Christians. But a sort of obligate profession of faith seems kind of unnecessary, to me. Everyone who takes spirituality seriously, tends to place some level of pride or faith or whatever into their particular beliefs. Still, I just don't feel the need to bring it into every conversation, and would generally rather keep it to myself, because I know some people are going to disagree with me, and unless it's entirely relevant, then there's not much point in talking about it. If someone asks, I'll indulge. If the topic somehow comes up, I'll explain my particular stance on the big questions, etc. But unless it's relevant, it can just seem a bit (for a lack of a better word) confontational.

*note: I haven't read through the whole thread, so I'm not saying it wasn't relevant in this case. Just that the sort of obligate "faith in every one of my posts" just seems a bit over-zealous. Though if you were just going for literary effect in that you wouldn't censor your spirituality for the sake of others, then I can agree with what you're saying. I don't think people should censor themselves at another's request.

While it's not really my say, that seems a bit excessive. What if your post is completely unrelated to theology or spirituality? Would you just try to work it in somehow?

I don't have a problem with Christians. But a sort of obligate profession of faith seems kind of unnecessary, to me. Everyone who takes spirituality seriously, tends to place some level of pride or faith or whatever into their particular beliefs. Still, I just don't feel the need to bring it into every conversation, because I know some people are going to disagree with me, and unless it's entirely relevant, then there's not much point in talking about it.

*note: I haven't read through the whole thread, so I'm not saying it wasn't relevant in this case. Just that the sort of obligate "faith in every one of my posts" just seems a bit over-zealous. Though if you were just going for literary effect in that you wouldn't censor your spirituality for the sake of others, then I can agree with what you're saying. I don't think people should censor themselves at another's request.

Wow, first, I'd like to thank you for a thought provoking post. :)

In regards to your first two questions, I don't really have any area of my life that isn't somehow related to spirituality or theology. What I used to be like completely prevented me from being able to live life. All I did was drink, watch porn, pick up prostitutes, use drugs, and run around trying to shit on people. I was rather empty inside. After coming to the point where I let God enter my life, my entire motivations and desires in life have been reworked and reorganized. Every bit of death leading up to my conversion, and every bit of growth since, is related to my faith.

I don't try to turn threads into theological discussion, but this is the truth that motivated the statement you asked those questions about: The life I have now has proceeded from the moment of conversion; the enslavement I lived in is no more and I am a new creature. I am free to engage in arts, music, work, play, family, relationships, philosophies, and more...and now, not as something to temporarily distract me from who I am, but as a part of who I am. All that I am today stems from faith, so without a single aspect of my life today not having that influence, it is not possible for me to speak of my activities, thoughts, or feelings without my faith somehow showing through.

It also carries the sentiment you guessed at in your last paragraph.

Man you don't actually believe theres an invisible guy in the sky do you? Is it so hard to imagine the events in your life were your doing?

You're a fucking idiot.

Jesus man, thats not even what he was saying.

You're a fucking idiot.

Jesus man, thats not even what he was saying.

I know I just like fucking with religious people. I don't know if you've noticed I'm not exactly being productive in this thread...

Who the fuck cares what he believes in? If you honestly can't see the validity of faith and accept that someone has a different belief system different from yours, then you're as small minded and ignorant as the religious believers you feel so superior to.

actually, I just accept the fact that no one knows, and I don't feel so overwhelmed by the world that I ascribe everything to a personified imaginary being.

But do I care what he believes? hell no. I've yet to see someone who was convinced to change their faith by the internet.

Wow, first, I'd like to thank you for a thought provoking post. :)

In regards to your first two questions, I don't really have any area of my life that isn't somehow related to spirituality or theology. What I used to be like completely prevented me from being able to live life. All I did was drink, watch porn, pick up prostitutes, use drugs, and run around trying to shit on people. I was rather empty inside. After coming to the point where I let God enter my life, my entire motivations and desires in life have been reworked and reorganized. Every bit of death leading up to my conversion, and every bit of growth since, is related to my faith.

I don't try to turn threads into theological discussion, but this is the truth that motivated the statement you asked those questions about: The life I have now has proceeded from the moment of conversion; the enslavement I lived in is no more and I am a new creature. I am free to engage in arts, music, work, play, family, relationships, philosophies, and more...and now, not as something to temporarily distract me from who I am, but as a part of who I am. All that I am today stems from faith, so without a single aspect of my life today not having that influence, it is not possible for me to speak of my activities, thoughts, or feelings without my faith somehow showing through.

It also carries the sentiment you guessed at in your last paragraph.

My pleasure. I do this sort of stuff 'for fun'. I don't know if that sort of makes me an oddball or something.

I can understand what you're saying. That sort of stuff is very powerfully transformative. And I do sort of see spiritual underpinnings behind everything. I guess you could say I consider myself a pretty 'spiritual' person, whatever the hell that would mean (can we say, ambiguity? lol) But, yeah, that sort of stuff has the power to completely reform your life. I suppose that's generally it's value: as a beneficial lense through which to view the world.

There's one thing I heard, I can't exactly remember it verbatim. It went something like: 'When you see the Universe/Creation within yourself, and you see yourself in all of creation/ the Universe, then you are enlightened' I think my memory chopped it to shit, but I think I managed to carry over the general sentiment. I'm not sure if it really applies to what was said, but I think there's an indescribable value to seeing spirituality everywhere. Even potentially those things that would do us harm (our enemies, or the hungry lion that is about to devour us, etc.)

And in a (perhaps vain) attempt to tie this back into the original topic: Girls tend to like guys with spiritual clarity. Doesn't particularily matter what it is, as long as you can argue your case effectively and evokatively, they'll be drawn to the 'depth' in what you're saying.

I know you probably aren't, but your somewhat lack of humility about your faith makes it appear that you're either trolling or a hypocrite. From my perspective, faith/spirituality is really an internal affair that doesn't need to be discussed if whoever you're talking to isn't interested in it. If you're trying to help people find the "truth", it's only counter-productive.

I have nothing to add to the original discussion.

You are correct, I didn't need to respond to the post about me being a 'god lover'. That was the point at which faith ceased to be the influence of the thread and became the thread, which makes this the wrong forum for the thread. :/

good guys win too.

but bad guys can have their cake and eat it too.

I laughed my way through most of this thread. Hilarious.

I get pussy, and at a party, I'll have just about every woman's attention drawn to me. Why? cause I'm well rounded and adaptive. I adapt to every single situation to the best of my abilities, and this brings success in Life. Women love men that win, and the well rounded man is the ultimate mate in a woman's eyes.

I pull in a spectrum of women too, from the good girl to the bad girl. The funny thing that I find is that when you're very adaptive, women become all the same. The good girl will become dirty minded, and the slut will become faithful. The bitch becomes nice too. When women get everything they need from their man, they're all quite pleasant really. Women only require one thing from there guy these days, and that's emotional fulfillment. This requires a well-rounded adaptive approach. Some days they need a shoulder to cry on, and others tough love. If you have physical, emotional, and intellectual strength, you will get any woman you fancy. So far, I haven't really met a woman I didn't like.

Strong, well rounded, and adaptive, is what women like.

http://www.freewebs.com/pickleheadsgang/marlboro%20man%202.jpg

i couldnt help but laugh when i pictured you looking like this speaking your post!

You want to know my ego? Here, I'll describe it to you: It's completely narcissistic, has no faith in anything, yearns for death, thinks the government is out to kill it, is so filled with lust that it became addicted to child pornography, is obsessed with drugs and alcohol, is obsessed with prostitutes to the point of attempting to rape one, is so obsessed with itself that no love for another human being could get in the way of what it wants, has no problem with physical hurting people, revels in emotionally damaging people...hell, I could go on for much longer describing what *I*, that is, my ego, is. You think I think I am righteous? BLIND MAN, GOD IS RIGHTEOUS BECAUSE BY HIS GRACE ALONE I DO NOT HAVE TO LIVE IN THE AGONIZING HELL THAT IS MY EGO, BY HIS GRACE ALONE AM I FREE FROM THE BONDAGE OF THAT MONSTER, BY HIS GRACE ALONE HAS MY LIFE BEEN RAISED FROM SLEEPING ON GRAVEL FACING LIVER FAILURE WITH A CONSCIENCE EATING MY MIND AWAY AND YEARNING FOR DEATH'S SWEET EMBRACE TO WHAT IT IS TODAY!

I know my self is not righteous, and I thank God every single morning and every single night that my self is no longer even a part of my thoughts, feelings, and actions today.

O rly?

You want to know my ego? Here, I'll describe it to you: It's completely narcissistic, has no faith in anything, yearns for death, thinks the government is out to kill it, is so filled with lust that it became addicted to child pornography, is obsessed with drugs and alcohol, is obsessed with prostitutes to the point of attempting to rape one, is so obsessed with itself that no love for another human being could get in the way of what it wants, has no problem with physical hurting people, revels in emotionally damaging people...hell, I could go on for much longer describing what *I*, that is, my ego, is. You think I think I am righteous? BLIND MAN, GOD IS RIGHTEOUS BECAUSE BY HIS GRACE ALONE I DO NOT HAVE TO LIVE IN THE AGONIZING HELL THAT IS MY EGO, BY HIS GRACE ALONE AM I FREE FROM THE BONDAGE OF THAT MONSTER, BY HIS GRACE ALONE HAS MY LIFE BEEN RAISED FROM SLEEPING ON GRAVEL FACING LIVER FAILURE WITH A CONSCIENCE EATING MY MIND AWAY AND YEARNING FOR DEATH'S SWEET EMBRACE TO WHAT IT IS TODAY!

I know my self is not righteous, and I thank God every single morning and every single night that my self is no longer even a part of my thoughts, feelings, and actions today.

I agree with you. I don't think you are righteous. I think you are weak. You aren't free either. You replaced your own self-created bondage with a new form of bondage. You had to give away the most important thing that we are granted at birth, free Will. Now your will is constrained by your religions laws, and therefore you are a servant, not free. At least I know now why my freedom that I talked about in my thread scared you so much, cause you can't even comprehend it, as all you know is bondage. I will say though that it sounds to me that your change was rather positive, considering your past situation. I have a little saying that really applies here. If you cannot master yourself, and rise up and become a master amongst men; choose wisely who you serve as a slave.

I rose up, and my ego is a paradise.

http://www.freewebs.com/pickleheadsgang/marlboro%20man%202.jpg

i couldnt help but laugh when i pictured you looking like this speaking your post!

You know what the ironic thing is? I actually do look quite a bit like that guy, minus the cowboy get up, I'm younger, and I have blond hair. Got the big rough man hands and the thousand mile stare though, lol. I even have the deep voice, and my accent is pretty close too. I bet the marlboro man got so much poon.

I agree with you. I don't think you are righteous. I think you are weak. You aren't free either. You replaced your own self-created bondage with a new form of bondage. You had to give away the most important thing that we are granted at birth, free Will. Now your will is constrained by your religions laws, and therefore you are a servant, not free. At least I know now why my freedom that I talked about in my thread scared you so much, cause you can't even comprehend it, as all you know is bondage. I will say though that it sounds to me that your change was rather positive, considering your past situation. I have a little saying that really applies here. If you cannot master yourself, and rise up and become a master amongst men; choose wisely who you serve as a slave.

I rose up, and my ego is a paradise.

I agree somewhat, but I also think a person can think for themselves and still be religious, to some degree. Dogma doesn't necessarily imply a blind following of said dogma, sometimes it's a bit more conscientious.

I agree thinking for one's self is ideal, but different people have different circumstances. Christianity, specifically, doesn't work for me. Theology I have no problem with, speculatively. Christianity just isn't really my bag, because I think I have the authority when deciding what the Universe and existence all means to me. But if Christianity works for someone, I think you should just be glad someone is deriving a lot of joy and spiritual fulfillment, even if it does mean relinquishing some of our power.

I actually think one of our first mistakes is thinking we have too much power. We really have little power over the vast majority of our circumstances. Obviously we have the ability to shape our lives, but some things are always and permanently beyond our control. Some people deal with it nihilistically, and I have no problem with that perspective. Other people take a different perspective, I don't think it really matters. It's just a way for us to philosophically cope with suffering and our lack of power/control over much of our lives and what happens to us.

Which brings me to another point. I don't believe one's ego is intended to be a paradise. The ego is supposedly a very shallow and misguided part of our psyche. In terms of spiritual development, the vast amount involves dissolving one's ego, or recognizing it as the illusion that it is. You can't separate an individual from their circumstances.

It's like seeing a group of islands on the ocean, but once you go underneath the water, you realize each 'island' is just a part of one single landmass. Everything is connected. Literally, you yourself are not a separate entity, you're a part of the universe, just as seemingly everything else is. By virtue of this you can't separate and categorize. A person's 'self' transcends even their own perception of themselves. It includes anything that can be perceived, which actually means there could be a multiplicity of 'selves' among many things. People can't be reduced to their egos, attempting to do so is essentially a deep deprivation of spiritual development. There is just the vastness of reality, and perception. It's something innately more pure/essential and surpassing the ego construct in it's power or 'truth' within one's internal life.

I think that most girls think the bad guys are harder to please, so if the bad guy is with them they feel better about themselves almost. The bad guy is more desired so if you are with the bad guy you are more desired.

I agree somewhat, but I also think a person can think for themselves and still be religious, to some degree. Dogma doesn't necessarily imply a blind following of said dogma, sometimes it's a bit more conscientious.

I agree thinking for one's self is ideal, but different people have different circumstances. Christianity, specifically, doesn't work for me. Theology I have no problem with, speculatively. Christianity just isn't really my bag, because I think I have the authority when deciding what the Universe and existence all means to me. But if Christianity works for someone, I think you should just be glad someone is deriving a lot of joy and spiritual fulfillment, even if it does mean relinquishing some of our power.

I actually think one of our first mistakes is thinking we have too much power. We really have little power over the vast majority of our circumstances. Obviously we have the ability to shape our lives, but some things are always and permanently beyond our control. Some people deal with it nihilistically, and I have no problem with that perspective. Other people take a different perspective, I don't think it really matters. It's just a way for us to philosophically cope with suffering and our lack of power/control over much of our lives and what happens to us.

Which brings me to another point. I don't believe one's ego is intended to be a paradise. The ego is supposedly a very shallow and misguided part of our psyche. In terms of spiritual development, the vast amount involves dissolving one's ego, or recognizing it as the illusion that it is. You can't separate an individual from their circumstances.

It's like seeing a group of islands on the ocean, but once you go underneath the water, you realize each 'island' is just a part of one single landmass. Everything is connected. Literally, you yourself are not a separate entity, you're a part of the universe, just as seemingly everything else is. By virtue of this you can't separate and categorize. A person's 'self' transcends even their own perception of themselves. It includes anything that can be perceived, which actually means there could be a multiplicity of 'selves' among many things. People can't be reduced to their egos, attempting to do so is essentially a deep deprivation of spiritual development. There is just the vastness of reality, and perception. It's something innately more pure/essential and surpassing the ego construct in it's power or 'truth' within one's internal life.

I should have said, my ego leads me to paradise, as my Will guides it with knowledge of how to obtain that paradise. His lead him to hell. The kingdom of heaven is inside of you. You have to satisfy all parts of your conscious, including your ego. Can't let the ego escape your conscious control though, or you'll end up in bad shape, just like hexidecimal. Dancing with the devil.

To some extent I agree with you, but I also have some disagreement.

The moral system in religion is bondage though, whether you follow the whole set of morals, or are limited by only a single one, you're Will is limited. Circumstance also limits us physically, but not consciously. The physical world has no constraints on the subjective processes of the conscious, unless we let it.

Don't get me wrong though, I'm not shitting on this guy for taking shelter in religion. He was falling on his face and needed too. There is no shame in adopting a system for living if your's fails you. We're all human, and these things happen to the best of us. I completely empathize with him, even if I wouldn't choose it as my own path.

My system doesn't justify a thing. Neither does your skepticism, by the way, so while your relationships continue to be either non existent or complete crap, keep that in mind. You aren't willing to try something else? That's fine with me.


Wow. You obviously have serious problems with reading comprehension. I didn't say I didn't agree with you, I do agree with you. I'm just saying there's a massive whole in your theory which you continually fail to address. You have no idea about what my relationships are like, good or bad, so all bringing them into it does is weaken your argument and emphasise the fact that you're avoiding answering my question.

Seriously, man. I don't need to try something else, I'm basically with you on most of the points. All I did was ask a question.

As for my skepticism, well, I'd rather be a skeptic than be someone who unconditionally accepts everything as true without any proof or arguments.

the whole "nice guys finish last" is a self-fulfilling prophecy. however people who are inclined to believe in bullshit like that deserve what they get.

Oh well, if there's one example of it, it must be proof. Scientific method ftw.

i'm not saying that it's exclusive. Just that my situation matches the theory that the OP stated. Quit taking things so seriously.

i'm not saying that it's exclusive. Just that my situation matches the theory that the OP stated. Quit taking things so seriously.

Fair enough. I misinterpreted. Still, to base an opinion on a single event isn't really a great way to form opinions. That's like flipping a coin once and saying that coins always come up heads.

Sure you didn't say always, but the fact that you agree with OP's premise indicates that you think that it's true based off of one event. I'll take things as seriously as I damn well please. Don't you know this is the internet? srsly.

its all lies women are all evil

It's funny, you guys all see things in black and white. It all comes down to how strong your Will is, and your ability to spot women who are attracted to you. Whether you like it or not, every conversation is manipulation of the other person's Will and vise versa. For me, I can manipulate pretty much any woman that is attracted to me into sleeping with me for the night, and then I could dump her, or I could keep something long-term going and marry her. One choice makes me an asshole, and the other a good guy. I'm neither good or bad, I'm human. People who see life in good and bad, are the ones that lose out. Everyone is capable of both, and the situation determines everything. Some women also appreciate being treated like shit too. My ex got turned on by me forcing myself on her, slapping her around, usually during sex or leading up to sex though. She got a thrill out of it. She's not a whore, she was just human. Women are usually about as faithful as the reasons us guys give them to be. People would just rather label than accept their own inadequacies.

Well then you hit an interesting argument. Maybe this is true in the adult world.

But in the high school/college world, it seems to like there are either A) very few nice girls, or B) the theory's wrong. Most of the nice guys I know sit around single for a majority of their time.