the seven faces of God

[ArmsMerchant]

"if you don't make yourself equal to God, you can't perceive God." -- anonymous third-century Christian heretic

It has been noted here numerous times that we have different perceptions of God. We create our own reality--as the Veda puts it, "We are not in the world, the world is in us." Same thing with God.

Deepak Chopra posits that there are seven faces, or levels of God. If your God is first-level, you will not communicate well with someone whose God is seventh-level, for instance. Since God is infinite, he/she/it/them/whatever can manifest to us with equal validity at any level, depending on our own level of spiritual development--no one is any "better' than any other.

Level one -- God the protector --this is best recognized as the God of the Old Testament, the God which AF ( I think) and I both reject. This god is vengeful, capricious, quick to anger, jealous, judgemental, unfathomable and (sometimes) merciful.

Level two -- God the almighty --this is, I think, the God of Catholicism in general and the Jesuits in particular, being soverign, omnipotent, just, the answerer of prayers, impartial, rational, organized into rules.

Level three -- God of Peace -- This God is maybe a little more Hindu than Christian--as an Indian guru once said "You believe that you were created to serve God, but in the end you may discover tha God was created to serve you." This god is detached, calm, offering consolation, undemanding, conciliatory, silent, meditative.

Level four -- God the redeemer -- this God leans more toward the pagan conception of Goddess, having strong qualities we typically associate with the feminine. This God is understanding, tolerant, forgiving, nonjudgemental, inclusive and accepting.

Level five -- God the creator --One finds this god when intuition becomes so powerful that it must manifest physically. This is the level at which shamans and psychics typically work. This god is of unlimited creative potential, has control over space and time, abundant, open, generous, willing to be known, and
inspired.

Level six -- god of miracles -- This is the level of some saints, among the dozens of whom who could levitate, be in two places at once, emit light from their bodies at prayer, and do healings. This god is transformative, mystical, enlightened, beyond all causes, existing, magical, healing--an alchemist. Words can only convey a hint of this Being.

Level seven -- the god of pure being. This is the god who can only be experienced by going beyond experience. This God is unborn, undying, unchanging, umoving, unmanifest, immeasurable, invisible, intangible and infinite. This is the god spoken of by Sufi and Hindu sages. As Rumi wrote "There is someone who looks after us/ From behind the curtain./In truth we are not here/This is our shadow."

[Railroad Opticon]

That feels like it has some basis.

[Xerxes35]

Originally Posted by ArmsMerchant

"if you don't make yourself equal to God, you can't perceive God." -- anonymous third-century Christian heretic

It has been noted here numerous times that we have different perceptions of God. We create our own reality--as the Veda puts it, "We are not in the world, the world is in us." Same thing with God.

Deepak Chopra posits that there are seven faces, or levels of God. If your God is first-level, you will not communicate well with someone whose God is seventh-level, for instance. Since God is infinite, he/she/it/them/whatever can manifest to us with equal validity at any level, depending on our own level of spiritual development--no one is any "better' than any other.

Level one -- God the protector --this is best recognized as the God of the Old Testament, the God which AF ( I think) and I both reject. This god is vengeful, capricious, quick to anger, jealous, judgemental, unfathomable and (sometimes) merciful.

Level two -- God the almighty --this is, I think, the God of Catholicism in general and the Jesuits in particular, being soverign, omnipotent, just, the answerer of prayers, impartial, rational, organized into rules.

Level three -- God of Peace -- This God is maybe a little more Hindu than Christian--as an Indian guru once said "You believe that you were created to serve God, but in the end you may discover tha God was created to serve you." This god is detached, calm, offering consolation, undemanding, conciliatory, silent, meditative.

Level four -- God the redeemer -- this God leans more toward the pagan conception of Goddess, having strong qualities we typically associate with the feminine. This God is understanding, tolerant, forgiving, nonjudgemental, inclusive and accepting.

Level five -- God the creator --One finds this god when intuition becomes so powerful that it must manifest physically. This is the level at which shamans and psychics typically work. This god is of unlimited creative potential, has control over space and time, abundant, open, generous, willing to be known, and
inspired.

Level six -- god of miracles -- This is the level of some saints, among the dozens of whom who could levitate, be in two places at once, emit light from their bodies at prayer, and do healings. This god is transformative, mystical, enlightened, beyond all causes, existing, magical, healing--an alchemist. Words can only convey a hint of this Being.

Level seven -- the god of pure being. This is the god who can only be experienced by going beyond experience. This God is unborn, undying, unchanging, umoving, unmanifest, immeasurable, invisible, intangible and infinite. This is the god spoken of by Sufi and Hindu sages. As Rumi wrote "There is someone who looks after us/ From behind the curtain./In truth we are not here/This is our shadow."

And can you demonstrate this with any evidence? You certainly would win the nobel prize if you can.

[-ScreamingElectron-]

AM was not the originator of the idea, or so I read in his post.

But you also have to see that, even with solid proof, people would ignore it.

This doesn't seem to be a scientific fact, it is not a compound with a definate atomic weight.

I see some truth in the classification, There is rarely a single god who pools from all the elevels, or even two.

Now fo a asshole/religion classification table!

[Masero]

Why couldn't your God be a collection of all seven, just at different times in your walk of faith?

I think we too often try to humanize God or put him in a box. I'm quite sure that God is above human logic and classification, and ultimately above our ability to understand him completely.

[Whore of God]

Originally Posted by ArmsMerchant

"if you don't make yourself equal to God, you can't perceive God." -- anonymous third-century Christian heretic

It has been noted here numerous times that we have different perceptions of God. We create our own reality--as the Veda puts it, "We are not in the world, the world is in us." Same thing with God.

Deepak Chopra posits that there are seven faces, or levels of God. If your God is first-level, you will not communicate well with someone whose God is seventh-level, for instance. Since God is infinite, he/she/it/them/whatever can manifest to us with equal validity at any level, depending on our own level of spiritual development--no one is any "better' than any other.

Level one -- God the protector --this is best recognized as the God of the Old Testament, the God which AF ( I think) and I both reject. This god is vengeful, capricious, quick to anger, jealous, judgemental, unfathomable and (sometimes) merciful.

Level two -- God the almighty --this is, I think, the God of Catholicism in general and the Jesuits in particular, being soverign, omnipotent, just, the answerer of prayers, impartial, rational, organized into rules.

Level three -- God of Peace -- This God is maybe a little more Hindu than Christian--as an Indian guru once said "You believe that you were created to serve God, but in the end you may discover tha God was created to serve you." This god is detached, calm, offering consolation, undemanding, conciliatory, silent, meditative.

Level four -- God the redeemer -- this God leans more toward the pagan conception of Goddess, having strong qualities we typically associate with the feminine. This God is understanding, tolerant, forgiving, nonjudgemental, inclusive and accepting.

Level five -- God the creator --One finds this god when intuition becomes so powerful that it must manifest physically. This is the level at which shamans and psychics typically work. This god is of unlimited creative potential, has control over space and time, abundant, open, generous, willing to be known, and
inspired.

Level six -- god of miracles -- This is the level of some saints, among the dozens of whom who could levitate, be in two places at once, emit light from their bodies at prayer, and do healings. This god is transformative, mystical, enlightened, beyond all causes, existing, magical, healing--an alchemist. Words can only convey a hint of this Being.

Level seven -- the god of pure being. This is the god who can only be experienced by going beyond experience. This God is unborn, undying, unchanging, umoving, unmanifest, immeasurable, invisible, intangible and infinite. This is the god spoken of by Sufi and Hindu sages. As Rumi wrote "There is someone who looks after us/ From behind the curtain./In truth we are not here/This is our shadow."

Personally I would switch around level three and level four. Level 5 shamanic stuff is all in their minds. They alter their own consciousness, brainwave patterns and neurochemistry through drugs, sonic driving etc. until they start to see the Spirit World. From my perspective, they are percieving illusiary beings because of their altered states of consciousness - a disruption in their normal brain chemistry. But even "normal" reality is illusiary, at least to Buddhists and myself.

As you said in quoting the Veda, "We are not in the world, the world is in us." Whatever you percieve/think/feel, is effectively your reality. There's an old buddhist story about a monkey trapped in a house... it's a great analogy for this. in your thread 'What is meditation?' I mentioned a book, Cutting through Spiritual Materialism. If you ever get a hold of it, read the section about the monkey.

on that note, Level 7 sounds like buddhist descriptions of enlightenment

[Hexadecimal]

AM, have you read anything on how long it typically takes a person to be lifted from hell to the seventh heaven?

I've only been in the seventh heaven once while alive, and I held command over the wind (it stopped upon the instant telling it so, and began upon the instant telling it so) until I shrunk back to a lower heaven. That was the moment I quit seeing NDEs as hallucinations and spirituality as nonsense. Nature obeyed...for no understood reason.

[kurdt318]

I'd say the majority of the time, at his current point in my life, I range between a level 3 and a 4. I've also experienced levels 2,5 and 7.

[Bukujutsu]

Originally Posted by Hexadecimal

AM, have you read anything on how long it typically takes a person to be lifted from hell to the seventh heaven?

I've only been in the seventh heaven once while alive, and I held command over the wind (it stopped upon the instant telling it so, and began upon the instant telling it so) until I shrunk back to a lower heaven. That was the moment I quit seeing NDEs as hallucinations and spirituality as nonsense. Nature obeyed...for no understood reason.

lol +2

[godfather89]

Originally Posted by ArmsMerchant

"if you don't make yourself equal to God, you can't perceive God." -- anonymous third-century Christian heretic

It has been noted here numerous times that we have different perceptions of God. We create our own reality--as the Veda puts it, "We are not in the world, the world is in us." Same thing with God.

Deepak Chopra posits that there are seven faces, or levels of God. If your God is first-level, you will not communicate well with someone whose God is seventh-level, for instance. Since God is infinite, he/she/it/them/whatever can manifest to us with equal validity at any level, depending on our own level of spiritual development--no one is any "better' than any other.

The third century heretic was indeed a Gnostic. The belief that you are a part of God and yet God transcends you. Panentheism is being stated here. But this heretic does not equate your ego with trying to make yourself equal with God, for that can never be... at least initially.

The idea is similar to Gnosticism that there are three levels to a human being: Carnal (Hylic), Psychic (The Soul or Psyche or Psychology), and Spiritual (Pneumatic). This here is similar to our connection of how we perceive God and ourselves. Most are Pre-dominantly Psychic. It should be noted that in this Gnostic view you are all three yet one is more pre-dominant in you.

[Rykoshet]

Why only seven? There's been so many different opinions out there, not to mention you only stuck to monotheistic beliefs.

Also, why stop at the seventh level. Are there not those who can transcend that level and see God in yet a more involved light. I mean, who is to say we are not all marionettes and God is playing each of us? Granted there's not theological scriptures about this sort of God, but if I or anyone else can think it up, does it not hold as much merit as a book a group of people got together, wrote, edited, and published?

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by Masero

Why couldn't your God be a collection of all seven, just at different times in your walk of faith?

I think we too often try to humanize God or put him in a box. I'm quite sure that God is above human logic and classification, and ultimately above our ability to understand him completely.

Point made. I think most people agree that God is infinite. Thing is, our comprehension is not, so we try to put God in human terms--which often does God a great disservice..

But those of us who commune with God on a day to day basis usually relate to him/her/it/them/whatever on one of those seven levels at a time. Mostly I'm at the third or fourth level, sometimes at the fifth, and at the seventh only a few times and not for long at that.

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by Xerxes35

And can you demonstrate this with any evidence? You certainly would win the nobel prize if you can.

The "evidence" chimera rears its ugly head once more.

As I have stated many times before in various contexts, my only "evidence" is personal experience.

I have read, and accept as true, that it is the soul's intention to know itself experientially--and thus to know God. The soul understands that We and God are One--that at the Highest Reality, we are All One--even as the mind denies this truth, and the body acts out this denial.

The soul understands what the mind cannot conceive.

[Hexadecimal]

Originally Posted by Rykoshet

Why only seven? There's been so many different opinions out there, not to mention you only stuck to monotheistic beliefs.

Also, why stop at the seventh level. Are there not those who can transcend that level and see God in yet a more involved light. I mean, who is to say we are not all marionettes and God is playing each of us? Granted there's not theological scriptures about this sort of God, but if I or anyone else can think it up, does it not hold as much merit as a book a group of people got together, wrote, edited, and published?

That we are marionettes and God is playing us IS the seventh. Or, as Solomon says towards the end of his mental breakdown: Verily, we are all of one soul. (This is an observation marked towards all life, not just humans)

[Rolloffle]

Originally Posted by Railroad Opticon

That feels like it has some basis.

lol wut?

[swissblade]

I say switch to hinduism ASAP.

Why i like hinduism the most?

Islam, christianity talks about only ONE god. But hinduism is NOT like that..

though hinduism say there is one god it can manifest in different FORMS.

Thats why there are 33,000000 gods in hinduism.. just imagine.

Some people call type bullshit..

But let me give you an example:

You eat MANY things while having your meal.

Like starters, main course, dessert's, etc.,

why dont humans just eat one thing at once in a meal..

why dont people eat JUST carrot in a meal.. because if you want to be satisfied, you need to taste different things..

thats what hinduism gives you..

MANY GODS to satisfy your spirit.

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by Rykoshet

Why only seven? There's been so many different opinions out there, not to mention you only stuck to monotheistic beliefs.

Also, why stop at the seventh level. Are there not those who can transcend that level and see God in yet a more involved light. I mean, who is to say we are not all marionettes and God is playing each of us?

Why seven? Beats me--but seven comes up an awful lot in both metaphysics and folklore. But I think those seven cover all the bases. And polytheism fits in too, when you look at say, old Greek myths--many of their gods reflect a single one of the seven faces.

The marionette thing--that would be level one--read the Book of Job for a perfect example.

[pwntbypancakes]

Originally Posted by Hexadecimal

AM, have you read anything on how long it typically takes a person to be lifted from hell to the seventh heaven?

I've only been in the seventh heaven once while alive, and I held command over the wind (it stopped upon the instant telling it so, and began upon the instant telling it so) until I shrunk back to a lower heaven. That was the moment I quit seeing NDEs as hallucinations and spirituality as nonsense. Nature obeyed...for no understood reason.

sometimes i cant even read this guys bullshit and stop halway through a paragraph such as this..

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by pwntbypancakes

sometimes i fail to comprehend this persons metaphysics..

Fixed.

[woodlander]

It is a very interesting way of looking at things. I don't think you can say much else though.

Humans have a remarkable capacity to develop cohesive belief structures and then perceive reality within those structures. (I am probably not doing a very good job of expressing the idea here).

I would have to assume God could manifest himself in any and/or all ways, but you see what you are looking for, if that makes any sense.

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by woodlander

I would have to assume God could manifest himself in any and/or all ways, but you see what you are looking for, if that makes any sense.

Exactly. The old paradigm says that seeing is believing.

The new paradigm says that believing is seeing,which is just another way of saying that we all create our own reality.

[Z He Lives 2001]

What an adorable little story.

[BrokeProphet]

Originally Posted by Z He Lives 2001

What an adorable little story.

LOL...

Originally Posted by Hexadecimal

AM, have you read anything on how long it typically takes a person to be lifted from hell to the seventh heaven?

I've only been in the seventh heaven once while alive, and I held command over the wind (it stopped upon the instant telling it so, and began upon the instant telling it so) until I shrunk back to a lower heaven. That was the moment I quit seeing NDEs as hallucinations and spirituality as nonsense. Nature obeyed...for no understood reason.

Hex...were you asleep? We call those dreams. They can get pretty scary. You should refrain from confusing sleepy time with wakey time.

[Whore of God]

Originally Posted by ArmsMerchant

The "evidence" chimera rears its ugly head once more.

As I have stated many times before in various contexts, my only "evidence" is personal experience.

I have read, and accept as true, that it is the soul's intention to know itself experientially--and thus to know God. The soul understands that We and God are One--that at the Highest Reality, we are All One--even as the mind denies this truth, and the body acts out this denial.

The soul understands what the mind cannot conceive.

Are there any techniques to guide people toward having this personal experience?

[Whore of God]

Originally Posted by Hexadecimal

AM, have you read anything on how long it typically takes a person to be lifted from hell to the seventh heaven?

I've only been in the seventh heaven once while alive, and I held command over the wind (it stopped upon the instant telling it so, and began upon the instant telling it so) until I shrunk back to a lower heaven. That was the moment I quit seeing NDEs as hallucinations and spirituality as nonsense. Nature obeyed...for no understood reason.

I can't help but think you're deluded in regard to wind thing. The wind probably changed the moment you tried to change it, due to sheer coincidence. Your brain then registered it as an unusual event, but you dont think about all the times it DIDN'T happen.

Christians saying Hurricane Katrina was caused by God's wrath comes to mind. There are natural weather patterns, they are predictable.

[Hexadecimal]

Originally Posted by BrokeProphet

LOL...



Hex...were you asleep? We call those dreams. They can get pretty scary. You should refrain from confusing sleepy time with wakey time.

No, it was one of the four times I've been awake.

[Hexadecimal]

Originally Posted by Whore of God

I can't help but think you're deluded in regard to wind thing. The wind probably changed the moment you tried to change it, due to sheer coincidence. Your brain then registered it as an unusual event, but you dont think about all the times it DIDN'T happen.

Christians saying Hurricane Katrina was caused by God's wrath comes to mind. There are natural weather patterns, they are predictable.

Read my latest post in the Bodhisattva thread.

[SilentMind]

God sucks. Dick.

Only idiots, drunks, and ex-convicts turn to religion.

With that said, I still found this to be an extremely insightful thread. Thank you.

[Masero]

I don't understand why people who are without religion congregate around a religious sub forum.

[AngryFemme]

I can't speak for everyone, but I can explain why I've enjoyed this forum for many years, though I'm not religious:

It's the belief in belief that's fascinating, to me. It's learning about how others use the God concept in their life to help them through dark days and bad times, and learning through the trials and tribulations of others how to make my own personal struggles more positive, even though I don't rely on God to see me through.

It's interesting to hear how other people interpret their religion. It's interesting to learn how they came to know God, and it's very valuable to me to have a group of (anonymous) peers offer their opinions on what God is (or isn't).

I've seen the God concept presented in so many different ways on here. It helps reaffirm my own stance, and helps reinforce some core beliefs I hold onto, some that tend to slip away from me from time to time. Beyond all the arguments, name-calling, finger-pointing and ridicule that goes on here, there's something to be said for a group of atheists and a group of theists developing a rapport with one another that might be absent out in The Real. Something about the online disinhibition experience - it brings out a very raw and no-holds-barred discourse that allows each participant a stand behind the proverbial podium and an audience that might otherwise not listen if they were approached any other way.

I always wonder at the end of the day (or at the end of a post) how something I or someone else might have said may have influenced another individual. While most of us claim NOT to be pushing agendas, it's evident in our banter that we're ALL perspective-pushers in our own rite.

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by Whore of God

Are there any techniques to guide people toward having this personal experience?

Good question. However, there is no good, pat answer. We are ALL on the road to sainthood, but it is more like the ultimate superhighway--it has bazillion lanes. Some of us are in the passing lane,others in the slow lane, some temporarily parked on the shoulder with a flat tire. But we are all headed in the same direction,and no "lane" has to be any better than another.

Nature helps a lot, which is one reason I love living here so much. Just contemplating the snow-capped mountains is quite inspirational. Meditation might help. Doing good works might help. Meditation and/or mescaline might help. In my case,simply CHOOSING to be enlighted works--sometimes. One time,I was sitting in an outhouse after just having read a bunch of good metaphysicial stuff,and saw a little spider--and I attained unity consciousness with the darn thing--I knew in my heart exactly what it felt like to be a spider. Another time, I did the same thing with a tree.

Whatever works, work--effectiveness is the measure of truth.

[pwntbypancakes]

Originally Posted by Hexadecimal

AM, have you read anything on how long it typically takes a person to be lifted from hell to the seventh heaven?

I've only been in the seventh heaven once while alive, and I held command over the wind (it stopped upon the instant telling it so, and began upon the instant telling it so) until I shrunk back to a lower heaven. That was the moment I quit seeing NDEs as hallucinations and spirituality as nonsense. Nature obeyed...for no understood reason.

pics or it did'n't happen


oh and btw, if neither level is better than the other, why use the term level with a connotation of being increasing? why not use a better "equal" term

[~son~of~random~]

Originally Posted by ArmsMerchant

The "evidence" chimera rears its ugly head once more.

As I have stated many times before in various contexts, my only "evidence" is personal experience.

I have read, and accept as true, that it is the soul's intention to know itself experientially--and thus to know God. The soul understands that We and God are One--that at the Highest Reality, we are All One--even as the mind denies this truth, and the body acts out this denial.

The soul understands what the mind cannot conceive.

Then why do you think the soul is bound to the body?

[ArmsMerchant]

Originally Posted by ~son~of~random~

Then why do you think the soul is bound to the body?

Actually, I don't. If I gave that impression, I erred.

IMHO, the body is simply the means by which the soul manifests on the material plane--sort of like the way your TV is the means by which Jay Leno manifests in your living room--your soul is no more bound to or in your body than Jay is bound to or in your TV. (Crude analogy, I know, but all I could come up with.)

The soul--like mind itself--is nonlocal--that is, everywhere in general and nowhere (which also = now, here) in particular.

Congratulations you figured out the most simple explanation of God and its different minds lol this is so basic

[Masero]

Originally Posted by Rust

You think I'm a pain in the ass? Neat. Who gives a shit?

You did answer him... obviously you do.

[Rust]

Originally Posted by Masero

You did answer him... obviously you do.

Answering someone means you give a shit what they think of you? No, it does not.

It might mean I care enough about answering someone else's question (which is not the same as his opinion of me) to respond; which is to say not much at all since that reply took me less than 4 seconds to make.

[redzed]

Another great thread suffocating due to squabbling!

Arms the number seven is usually interpreted as representative of perfection. Obviously the universe is infinite and any description of divinity would also be infinite, why then does the human mind need to 'see' a face? What is it that drives one to know?

BP I was illustrating the point that the Greek could also be read as reason. Not suggesting the xian god is logic, rather that the precursors of xianity saw reason as the highest principle. Ignore the supernatural external for a moment and think of what is the highest or controlling principle of your mind, what is it?

[Hexadecimal]

Originally Posted by Rust

Answering someone means you give a shit what they think of you? No, it does not.

It might mean I care enough about answering someone else's question (which is not the same as his opinion of me) to respond; which is to say not much at all since that reply took me less than 4 seconds to make.

But now you're defending your self as if there is something wrong about caring what people think of you in the first place, and that's certainly not grounded in logic.

[Rust]

Except I wasn't defending myself because I think there is something wrong about caring what people think of me in the first place.

[jb_mcbean]

Originally Posted by ArmsMerchant

"if you don't make yourself equal to God, you can't perceive God." -- anonymous third-century Christian heretic

It has been noted here numerous times that we have different perceptions of God. We create our own reality--as the Veda puts it, "We are not in the world, the world is in us." Same thing with God.

Deepak Chopra posits that there are seven faces, or levels of God. If your God is first-level, you will not communicate well with someone whose God is seventh-level, for instance. Since God is infinite, he/she/it/them/whatever can manifest to us with equal validity at any level, depending on our own level of spiritual development--no one is any "better' than any other.

Level one -- God the protector --this is best recognized as the God of the Old Testament, the God which AF ( I think) and I both reject. This god is vengeful, capricious, quick to anger, jealous, judgemental, unfathomable and (sometimes) merciful.

Level two -- God the almighty --this is, I think, the God of Catholicism in general and the Jesuits in particular, being soverign, omnipotent, just, the answerer of prayers, impartial, rational, organized into rules.

Level three -- God of Peace -- This God is maybe a little more Hindu than Christian--as an Indian guru once said "You believe that you were created to serve God, but in the end you may discover tha God was created to serve you." This god is detached, calm, offering consolation, undemanding, conciliatory, silent, meditative.

Level four -- God the redeemer -- this God leans more toward the pagan conception of Goddess, having strong qualities we typically associate with the feminine. This God is understanding, tolerant, forgiving, nonjudgemental, inclusive and accepting.

Level five -- God the creator --One finds this god when intuition becomes so powerful that it must manifest physically. This is the level at which shamans and psychics typically work. This god is of unlimited creative potential, has control over space and time, abundant, open, generous, willing to be known, and
inspired.

Level six -- god of miracles -- This is the level of some saints, among the dozens of whom who could levitate, be in two places at once, emit light from their bodies at prayer, and do healings. This god is transformative, mystical, enlightened, beyond all causes, existing, magical, healing--an alchemist. Words can only convey a hint of this Being.

Level seven -- the god of pure being. This is the god who can only be experienced by going beyond experience. This God is unborn, undying, unchanging, umoving, unmanifest, immeasurable, invisible, intangible and infinite. This is the god spoken of by Sufi and Hindu sages. As Rumi wrote "There is someone who looks after us/ From behind the curtain./In truth we are not here/This is our shadow."

After knocking this thread off topic I've decided to do my duty and re-topicize it (that's right I just made that word up).
I suppose the ideas behind these beliefs show the link between the Dharmic and the Abrahamic religions, with the "level sevens" best described as the enlightened people and boddhisatvas and whatnot. That's my two pence.

[HatterMaxwell]

Originally Posted by Masero

Why couldn't your God be a collection of all seven, just at different times in your walk of faith?

I think we too often try to humanize God or put him in a box. I'm quite sure that God is above human logic and classification, and ultimately above our ability to understand him completely.

I disagree.
I don't feel like god would want to imperceptible.
Or create a being that can't understand its (god's) role in the creature's life.
No, god wants us to see it in everything we do, I enjoy a relationship with the god that I hope to meet in the afterlife.
The only thing that angers me is that it's a one way relationship.
I'm sure it has a reason, but I would really like to know why it won't speak to me.

[Masero]

Originally Posted by HatterMaxwell

I disagree.
I don't feel like god would want to imperceptible.
Or create a being that can't understand its (god's) role in the creature's life.
No, god wants us to see it in everything we do, I enjoy a relationship with the god that I hope to meet in the afterlife.
The only thing that angers me is that it's a one way relationship.
I'm sure it has a reason, but I would really like to know why it won't speak to me.

See that's not a relationship. I've heard God speak to me before, but not verbally.

I don't believe that God desires a personal relationship sometimes because it sometimes feels like he's only helping us b/c the nagging gets irritating. Others I know say they talk to God all the time and he listens.

I think when you pray, your subconscious is telling you what it wants you to hear, not God saying "go down this road" but your gut feeling either A. Putting Logic first or B. Putting Emotion first.

But then at other times it feels like God is there every step of the way... it's confusing. But it really all boils back to the tenant of faith.

If God really wanted us to rely on faith, then possibly he doesn't speak to us because he wants us to REALLY use faith to believe that the actions corresponding to your prayers are his way of saying yes or no or maybe later.

It sounds like a cop-out to some, but maybe they're just over-thinking the situation. Sometimes we let Logic rule our lives far too much and it ends up putting us in this wretched closed up box that really doesn't allow us any freedom of choice. Alternatively, some people over-use emotion too much to do the exact same thing. We need to find a happy balance.

[miner69ner]

Disclaimer: I don't look to Deepak Chopra for spiritual wisdom.

You say, "Level one -- God the protector --this is best recognized as the God of the Old Testament,". I don't deny that I consider Him to be a protector, but your statement tells me that you've never the book of Job.