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Backyard Ballistics This forum is dedicated to the safe teaching and responsible handling of high and low explosives. You will not find any information on how to make "bombs" or any such device(s) . Backyard ballistics will teach you the science and the art of pyrotechnics and how to manufacture and use explosives/pyrotechnics safely and responsibly. Backyard ballistics is also a haven for rocketry and pneumatic cannons. All information contained within this forum is for educational purposes ONLY. Totse does not accept responsiblity for any incident involving the use of the information contained within this forum.

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  #1   Add hydroponichronic to your ignore list  
Old 2007-06-18, 19:12
hydroponichronic hydroponichronic is offline
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Default Peroxide formation

Is there a rule of thumb for knowing how organic peroxides will form? I thought the peroxides bonds appeared where an oxygen is double bonded (AP, MEKP), but in benzoyl peroxide, it leaves the double bonded oxtgen unaltered. Also, what makes a compound able to become a peroxide?
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  #2   Add Mokothar to your ignore list  
Old 2007-06-18, 19:28
Mokothar Mokothar is online now
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Heresy, I live in Heresy Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful
Default Re: Peroxide formation

Peroxide implies that there are two oxygen atoms have both bonds with each other and both also have one additional heterogeneous bond.
Any molecule with such a chain is a peroxide.

Peroxidation happens when a stable and electrophile atom/chain/compound is exposed to a mono-hydrogen peroxide anion, the electrophile atom will connect with the peroxide chain.

Nucleophile nature can be induced by protonating an oxygen (C=O -> C-OH+ -> +C-OH) atom (as in AP synthesis), but doesn't have to happen like that.

Last edited by Mokothar : 2007-06-19 at 22:58.
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  #3   Add hydroponichronic to your ignore list  
Old 2007-06-19, 21:18
hydroponichronic hydroponichronic is offline
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Default Re: Peroxide formation

Thanks, Mokothar, but your reply only made me realize how little I actually know about chemistry. Among other things, I'm confused about the protonation of the C=O. Does the H+ come from the acid in the mixture or from a dissasociation of the H2O2 into H+ and HOO-?
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Old 2007-06-19, 22:58
Mokothar Mokothar is online now
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Heresy, I live in Heresy Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful Mokothar is helpful
Default Re: Peroxide formation

Both of those happen, and the "keton" carbon won't distinguish, but there should be way more H+ present from the acid catalyst.

I'm not sure on how exactly HOOH +H2O goes to HOO- and H3O+ though
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  #5   Add hydroponichronic to your ignore list  
Old 2007-06-22, 18:47
hydroponichronic hydroponichronic is offline
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Default Re: Peroxide formation

I think I get it. Thanks Mokothar.
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