hey, fellas ,

I was at work the other day and a group of us was talking about anhydrous and one guy told me that his cousin would use R12 , well i happen to see on one of these pages where it said you can use r12! so my question would be, if you do go with r12 does it require to get a whole new list of ingredients or just take out the anhydrous and replace with R12 ?

If any one can help me out then maybe i can return the favor sometime on down the line.



P.S. This is my first posting but i have had this site in my favorites for 8-9 months,so please bare with me while i learn something new ok? yes i read all the faq`s and did some searches first any help will sure help Thanks onreydog

this question has been asked here many times. each time it is asked all the people that are in the know say that r-12 wont work period. i guess thats prolly why you always see people say they heard from a friends cousin or something to that effect that it could be used as opposed to anyone claiming to have actually seen it work for themselves

Freon will NOT work. Period.

Lukky D

r12 can be used but its hard to produce anhydrous from it so man swims advice for you is to either make your own anhydrous ammonia or use the rp/i method goodluck!

make your own anhydrus,get amonia nitrate put 2-quarts in gollon glass jar add water until nitrate is covered.let sit over night shakeing helps,remove liquid place in another jar add dry ice fit lid (lid has aquarium line inserted in hole) place end of hose in your lithium fuel leave there until lithium strips melt.remove aqiarium line and proceed with your process. it works for me.

quote:Originally posted by suttleila:

r12 can be used but its hard to produce anhydrous from it so man swims advice for you is to either make your own anhydrous ammonia or use the rp/i method goodluck!

Ok sutt, you did it again. Both Luckky, and the Rain man said it CAN'T BE DONE! So why do you keep turnin around and making their replys seem like (well, if you're smart like me, it can be done but...) That's the wrong way to go about it bro. Don't question the authoritative figures in this forum. All you "know", is that obviously they know more about what they're talking about. So, leave it at that! Unless of course, you can legitimately challenge, and back up your claims. That'll make for less myths, and unestablished/untested claims floating around here.

Ok,I Think I understand a little better now, i like to thank you guys for input ,and sorry about asking the same question that you answerd before i looked thru several of the old postings i never did see that question ,i`ll search harder next time.

Now Then i have a question for any of you , my other buddy has access where he works to a few chemical`s, one that has cought my eye is this it comes in 50lb bags and the tag reads --- Anhydrous Nitrate ---

that is the only thing on the label!! what it looks like is small round pellet shape ,solid white in color , but after it has set in a sandwitch bag for a little while (4/5 days)it turns to a crystal like powder ! i have done a small amount of expermenting with it and i`m not having any luck that i know of (like cold/hot water) i am wondering if any of you can help me to make it work?

he works in a factory and they mix it with something to keep a great big vat(s) cool ,they make food for animals and this keeps it from overheating while they cook they`re batch(s) ! they go thru 100lb every 8 hours approxamently!!

any one have idea`s as to get it working ?

and again i like to thank all !!

oldonerydog

well said lways tired

What you need to do is ask him for ammonia nitrate, or prill, it is used at plants that manufacture fertilizer and or explosives,

annyhydrous nitrate probably could be used also but only for making grass green, ask this question to kirby.

quote:Originally posted by tReePHrOg:

What you need to do is ask him for ammonia nitrate, or prill, it is used at plants that manufacture fertilizer and or explosives,

annyhydrous nitrate probably could be used also but only for making grass green, ask this question to kirby.

then again annyhdrous nitrate may be ammonium nitrate. Im not sure.

Ty, kirby.

Ammonium nitrate (NH4NO3)

Granular 34% N

- 17.5% ammoniacal N (NH4+)

- 17.5% nitrate N (NO3-)

Anhydrous ammonia (NH3)

physical form:

liquid at <-33° C (-28° F)

gas at >-33° C (-28° F)

Ammonium nitrate can be used to manufacture NH3 but it's quite a process to go through with lots of smell, If you are really interested I will point you to some threads on the process.

Sam

Point on Sam. any help in the quest for knowledge is always useful.

LATER !!!! !!!!!!

Here is one that was wrote up by pikk from this board. Ammonium Nitrate can be used as the fertilizer. I only have a couple things that I might think would improve this post, One: Do not use brass fittings, they are highly corrosive when coming in contact with ammonia, and a pre-cooler inline before the dry ice bed I beleive would be beneficial. Making a coil of tubing layered in crushed ice with rock salt, then continue to the dry ice.

ok some have been posting how do i make nh3(annie) well maybee this will help some of you . swim post this in his birch forum(CH) so here goes.

Here are the things needed

1. 3-5 gallon igloo cooler

2. 1 1 gallon cooler

3. 1 bag of 34-0-0 Fertilizer (Caution look for the one that has a oxidizer sticker on it it must be 17% amonium nitrate. It will be small white pellets and stanky.

4. 5 cans Red Devil Lye

5. JB Weld (Quick Set)

6. Plastic 5 gallon gas can

7. 30 feet of 3/8 or 1/2 precoiled aircompresser hose

8 A couple of quick disconnects (male side)for aircompresser.

9. 5 feet half inch air compreser hose

10. 3 gallons of camp fuel or acetone

11. 30-40 pounds dry ice (it sounds like a lot but normally sold in 10lb blocks

12. Either a 5th bottle or thick glass catching vessel



Ok now this is swims first right up so be patient and spelling and greammer both suck. First step take your quick disconnect that has a 1/2 threads on it take the little ecape plug out og gas can a screw it into the gas can. now you might have to bore it out some but of well make sure it is real tight and seal with jb weld. Second get your precoiled air hose. cut off the extra 20 feet because you dont need a 50 ft coil. make it 30 feet. Get some wire tyes and make sure it keeps it formnow making sure you dont fuck up the spout on your cooler. Drill 2 holes in the cooler so you can put 2 more qd(quick disconnect) in the cooler and attach hose inside and make sure all is leak proof and air tight. So now looking at the cooler you have a coil in there that has been nicley coiled up and 2 qd on opisite corners. The reason you dont fuck up the spout is so u can get back your camp fuel or acetone when you are through. Ok now get about 4 feet of aircompresser hose and connect the 2 qd one from gas can and one to top side of the coil cooler. make sure you clamp the hose on the male sides of your qd with something so it can whithstand some pressure.Now for the fun part beat the hell out of your dry ice fill up your big cooler so the entire coil is covered. Dump in 2 gallons of camp fuel or acetone (if someone knows of something better to get the temp down please advise)let sit about 10 min get your remaing dry ice and a catcher bottle ready. Put in your catcher bottle pack with dry ice cover in camp fuel let sit 5 min. By this time your hoses should have frost on them from being so damn cold. Oh almost forgot get about 1 foot of hose connect it to qd and put other end paper towel wrapped to make it tight(but not airtight it will blow up if so) into your catcher botle. So now you have a continuse piece of hose from gas can into top of coil out of bottom of coller into catched bottle coverd in dry ice and camp fuel. Ok the way this need to be set up is like so you sit in chair place cooler higher than you and place catcher lower than cooler. Ok we are ready. I hope I havent lost anybody if so if you review the complete birch by Mister Clean you can get an idea of what we are trying to do. Ok now this is very important ALWAYS ADD WATER FIRST. you will see why later put 1- 8 oz glass of water in the gas can place 1/2 gallon of fertilizer into gas can, now quickly place i can of red devil lye in there and close vessle quickly. Ok pretty quick you will notice a reaction going on in there getting hot swelling the can ect that is what you want.Shake kick whatwever to keep pressure up. When suck back occurs lossen top and more fertilizer and lye and go again. NOW SWIM IS NO CHEMIST but seem what is happending is you are making hot ass smelly right now and your forsing it through -40 degree NP so it turn hot ass gass into nice smelly liquid. walla after a couple of cans blam you have a 5th bottle full of desired smelly.



Well Swim knows there will be questions so swim will answer. But before any wise ass says this wont work. try it before you post and you will be BIRCHING tommorow.

And here is the way they do it in the lab, http://www.rhodium.ws/chemistry/eleusis/ammonia.html

One more important thing I should mention, I do not know if you have ever been exposed to any anhydrous ammonia, but this shit is like really really potent smelly shit, like if you live in the city with neighbors near by, they will surely smell it, probably a block away if you don't have this set up in a manner that is is not leeching out in this process, one good wiff of the stuff instantly depletes all the oxygen in your lungs, I can not stress enough how dangerous this can be, lawfully and health wise, please carefully consider all this before attempting anything of this nature.

Sam

[This message has been edited by sam-63 (edited 09-02-2003).]