Ok...swim reached the step in the nano version by curb. that explains to add splashes of lye (which was 8gms??) I don't have swim's paperwork in front of me but anyway...add splashes until gone. Got that, now after shaking that up (with one hard shake) swim ended up with 3 layers in his vessel. The top was a clear solution, the bottom was where the lye remained, (like it said) but there was a thick middle layer of a bubbly looking brown sort of mess. It was about twice the width of the clear layer. Now, had swim not followed directions?? Or, is there a step that swim's instructions are missing?? He followed them to the letter...

or so he claims? Any ideas? Thank you in advance!

while doing my research on this paper, after pouring off lighter fluid and adding dh20 and 4 drops of h2s04, i imagined 2 layers in the tube. the top was watery and the bottom was thick. wondering about this also. let bottom thick layer evaporate and no results.

I'm tellin' ya boys, the writeup is in the works. I feel like such a piece of shit for not spending more time with it. I noticed lately that it seems like most everybody can get the hang of the reaction pretty quickly, and even if you end up with some nasty tasting, brown burning, pegylated meth from dirty pfed feedstock, you stil end up with meth.

The problem that most newbees are having, and will probably always have, is the post reaction workup. As you become more familiar with this technique, it becomes easier. That doesn't help you very much right now, though.

As for the answer to your question:

You have a polar (water) layer on the bottom. The nonpolar layer is on top. This is where the basified goodies are supposed to be. Then you have the middle layer. Probably the middle lyer is made up of varying sizes of bubbles. They may look like they are surrounded or coated with a brown film. When you give the flask (or tube) a swirl, they stay together like frog eggs. This layer will resolve itself in a couple of days. Fuck that. The best move is to pour the whole thing out of that fucking test tube crap and put it in a larger vessel. A friggin' tall olive jar kicks ass as it is tall and slender. So, pour it in another jar. Just dump the shit in. Rinse bullshit tube with a couple of mls. of DH2O. Do this twice. Then rinse the tube with whatever nonpolar you are using.(if you used some crappy lighter fluid, don't do it again. Go to the hardware store and get some VM&P Naptha. c'mon, really.) Do this twice. Make sure you pour everything together. Don't throw anything away.

Gotta hurry. Real quick. The middle layer was an emulsion. Goodies get trapped in there. The mixture must be stirred or mixed somehow after basing so that the freebase will move up into NP. This mixing will sometimes cause the middle layer. Break it up with stir rod swishing back and forth through it. Then pull off your NP and put in clean glass. Now add a little DH2O(it has to be DH2O or you are fucking up) and pretend you are at the stage where you just added your lye and are waiting for it to settle. Carry on . I'll try to get the learners method up soon. Gotta Go. Didn't proof. Sorry.

The "middle layer" is indeed an emulsion. The 2 main layers(Polar and Non-Polar) are having trouble seperating.

To fix this, just add a lot[don't get carried away though] of NaCl(table salt), trying to rest as much of it on the bubbles as possible. As the weight gets to heavy for them, they begin to sink and usually burst. Swirl the vessel.

Many things can cause this emulsion problem, the most common, shaking the 2 layers. Don't shake after adding a base like NaOH, rather, just swirl.

Mirror-like interfaces between the layers indicate a cleaner run reaction.

Lukky D

[This message has been edited by lukkydleprachan (edited 06-30-2003).]

The light at the end of this tunnel just got brighter, an look ^...it's swigotta an swirld

to the rescue! Thank you both for your input.

Swim did use Dh2o but opted for the cheaper lighter fluid as he had hurried himself into a pinch. *places hand on a bible* I SWEAR TO NEVER LET SWIM DO THAT AGAIN. Swim's gonna be thrilled to hear this!! Swim and I'll be anxiously waiting for your write up...gotta

Thanks again to you too LuckyD.

Oh yeah...you too nymph



Your descriptions could've fooled swim into thinkin you guys were outside swim's window..hahaha

[This message has been edited by AlwaysTired (edited 06-30-2003).]

ok, second dream here. went back thru a second time. this time, i imagined the bubbles. they disappeared rather quick and i imagined 2 layers w/mirror like interfaces. dreamed of evaporating 1st layer w/naptha. nothing. dreamed of evaporting bottom layer, nothing. what would one dream about doing with layer left w/lye? any suggestions on what is wrong with my dream? thanks all

swil is still having a problem too. swil tried to gass but didn't work either this is how swil does the post reaction and still comes out with shit nasty shit. after run add dh2o swirl the filter rp untill all out use 3 filters and plug then add colemans fuel shake and swirl seperate and repeat 2 more times then add more fuel and lye/water solution a little at a time gently shake and really swirl alot let settle then test polar layer for ph of 14 then let sit for 15-30 mins then seperate layers add dh2o and gently shake and swirl then seperate repeat this twice more then add alittle more dh2o and one drop of 20% murtic acid shake and swirl let settle and test polar layer for ph of 7 let sit for like 15-30 mins when there then seperate and boil down the polar layer. the first timessss swil came out with saltly lye tasting white powderey/crystals yuck! then second timessss swil came out with yellowish brown oily powder very yuck also. when swils almost get through evaporating you can see a yellowish kinda oily looking liquid on top after swil got disgusted swil tried gassing a few times and it didn't work either so swil is wondering if something is going wrong with the run and it its producing ioephedrine (or something) swil was reading uncle fester swil is very disgusted and thinks about quitting but that not swil's nature especially since swil can't figure this out swil will fuck with stuff until its understood hehe! also have lots of money tied up in this dream

Ok...nymph I'm gonna try and help you out. If I need to be corrected here, please...

anyone else feel free to throw in yer two cents. Now, when you get to the step where you've added the lye, you should only have two layers...if you've been paying attention to this thread. That's if you don't screw up as swim did. Then of the two layers, the clear layer seperates and floats atop the layer with the lye (at the bottom) of course. You carefuly draw off the top layer and put that in a clean tube/vessel. To that clean layer you add your DH2o, and your drops of acid. Then you shake that one up pretty good. That then seperates again into two layers. This time you want the bottom layer...carefuly draw that off the bottom and put in your dish for evaporation. And as they say "what's left after evaporation boys and girls...are the crystals of your dreams". Depending on your precleaning procedures it should be pretty well....good to go I guess you could say.

Swim's not sure if what remains in the jar with your lye is good for anything else after that....good luck

[This message has been edited by AlwaysTired (edited 07-01-2003).]

lukky--

I sure hope you guys remember that the post rxn learner is for newbees having trouble with the a/b. I don't want to get burned at the stake for going against the grain. Swigotta was doin it almost regularly, as a matter of fact, he was doing every nano this way and nobody was the wiser. I debated over adding in the salt thing, but didn't want to confuse and didn't have the time to explain.(now that I think about it, I don't know how to explain the salt.)

Anyway, as usual, I have to hurry.

Miss--

I am unsure what they put in that colemans fuel, so I cannot take on that area. I have a few things that jumped out at me:

1. For first filtering and initial diluting, make sure the DH2O is real hot. If a cotton in neck is used, one coffee filter is accepable.

2. One drop of 20% muriatic is enough to pull maybe 0.1 gram. Swigotta doesn't even worry about testing the pH when titrating. Why? He doesn't care. If he undershoots the pH, what he pulls first will be all meth, clean meth(or pseudo if the damn thing doesn't go all the way). On the other hand, if he overshoots the pH, there will be too much acid, the plate will dry up kinda yellow and smell nasty like hcl., but acetone will clean it up good and everything will still be good.

3. Don't fuck with the polar layer of the reaction mix, EVER. This is the only place to work until you figure out where and how to get the dope out. Actually don't BOIL anything down. When you have your acid water separated, put it in a pie plate and put it in front of a small space heater until dry.

4. Yellowish brown is probably pseudo contaminates like peg for the brown if it has a kinda sweet smell (forget that, everybody smells things differently) and the yellow is probably acid. When you get that nasty looking shit, dry it up good, scrape it.....find that recent thread about dual solvents by marased, its in there.

5. Fester, no. Hive, Geezmeister, yes. Good place to start. Read there, don't post.

In short, for the laymen:

The addition of NaCl, will attract the hydrogen molecules. After the hydrogen has released it's grasp upon the meth HCl molecules, they will have a free-ride into the Non-polar layer becoming Freebase Methamphetamine.

The NaCl works here, much like it does when drying solvents; By atracting excess hydrogen molecules towards it.

Lukky D

Groovy lukky--

Of course, I remembered that. I was just checking to make sure you did. Yeah..yeah..that's the ticket.

Let's take a look see.

cranker--

I'm sorry, I was going to say something earlier and got sidetracked, then ran out of time. The wife is always go, go, go. Let me see if I understand this correctly. You evapped the polar and non polar layers, both nothing. I assume you mean nothing that looked like what you wanted to see. If this is correct, then you mean that the lye layer is what was left over after evapping the polar. If there was any meth in the naptha, it was the freebase form and would be an oil. A little bit of oil spread out over a somewhat large surface may look like nothings there. Nah, there wasn't nothing there. ok, now take whatever you do have left, scrape it all together if its dry and put into a small jar. Add some fresh naptha (its only 3-4 bucks a quart, VM&P) if its available.then some DH2O. Mix it up good, let it sit and then see where you stand with the pH. 14-ok. <14 add more base. Titrate with acid.

About the acid thing. Make it up beforehand. This may sound ridiculous, but Swigotta takes a tall baby food jar (6 oz./180 ml.) and pours in a little 34%muriatic acid. Hell yes, no measurement. Then, he fills the jar with D water and gives it a stir, Probably 6-8 mls hcl 34% and 150mls. DH2O. Then, if its sometging like a 4-5 gram cook, he'll put about 4-5 mls. in the funnel, cap it and shake it hard while performing a traditional folk praise song and ritual dance for a FULL THREE MINUTES in an effort to appease the meth gods so they may bestow upon me their sacrament.

A bunch of lye locked on the bottom says there is obviously too much lye. I know thats the way curbie wrote it, but its too much.

When everything works out good and you get some pretty crystals in the plate, then the job has finally begun. ALWAYS at the very least, rinse the crystals with some dry acetone (or straight out of the can sometimes). Rinsing out the nasties is a must. Acetone is excellent for this.

Always remember this.

The jar that holds your leftovers is NEVER completely empty. Rinses will carry away a small amount of meth, don't throw them out. When you're all done pour your leftovers into a large carboy type container of about 12-20 liters. There are things that can be done with a carboy full of extraction mix.

Good things.

quote:Originally posted by gottagogo:

[B]find that recent thread about dual solvents by marased, its in there.

B]

Gotta, that's Masahed, not marased!! Not a matter of any importance, it's just that I've read a few of that guys posts over at CH, I ain't him!

No biggy, just thought I'd mention it.

Peace.

quote:Originally posted by gottagogo:

Then, if its sometging like a 4-5 gram cook, he'll put about 4-5 mls. in the funnel, cap it and shake it hard while performing a traditional folk praise song and ritual dance for a FULL THREE MINUTES in an effort to appease the meth gods so they may bestow upon me their sacrament.



That is pretty wild sounding Gotta... But AAMOF Swirh likes the song technique (at least mentally--when the other voices aren't screaming...). The ritualistic pre-post waitandseewhathappened transistional phase prayer is performed religiously by Friend of Swirh, lol. Hey...it can't hurt right?? If memory serves correctly...an old Festerism (least that is the first recollection of it).

Swirh usually has the old saying (during all the shaking) of "Sure am glad for all that practice in highschool". Wondered about getting two hungry dogs and tie a steak to container (wrapped appropiately for safety of course) and let 'em go at it. Maybe a friend with epilepsy and without meds for a couple of days with container strapped on their chest. I know, pretty far-fetched but it could happen...hehe.

Seriously though...Swirh has considered the idea of a small motor (maybe bench mounted or at the least on some plywood or some type of base) with a ghetto rigged containment system for containers attached to a cam with an elliptical type rotation. Have heard a paint shaker motion isn't ideal...but one might be able to find a oblong action cam if one looked hard enough. Reason for the tip is Swirh figures that Gotta prob would preciate the idea and keep from shaking a damn rotator cup out or something.

after 5-6 dreams, my dreams are turning to nightmares! i keep chasing the end w/nothing. in this re-occuring dream, i see the final 2 layers. mirrored. i imagine evaporating, but always dream ends w/a thin oily layer w/nothing. i am not able to scrape anything at the end. just an oily streak. in this dream, i have searched postings, i have followed tips, but still no end in sight. in this dream, i like to think i am not stupid or dense. have learned to "read between some lines" of sorts. have lots and lots of notes (i read many things here for a couple of months before actually getting the nerve to post). read hiv, rhod, and am anxiously waiting the ch site or similar site to be put back online so additional research can be done. if anyone has an idea of what i am doing wrong in my dream, i would be grateful. don't want to have my dream turned nightmare crash and burn with me in it!!

how long and how hot is swinymph cooking the rxn the reason swil asks is because they were have similar problems and then decided to use a balloon and cook for 15hrs at about 115F-130F swil finially got something back (about 50% yeild )don't know how good but aleast its something. swirl still has some psuedo left so they will do two or three more small runs to make sure swil gets it right (please pray) then swil's plans on doing an a/b extraction on psuedo so it will be cleaner and let it rxn for atleast 24 hrs more yeild and more pure

in this dream, using a lightbulb w/tube for cooking via the curbshot nano method. followed instructions as written as suggested, so only 1 hr. balloon was filling somewhat. temp was about 75 to 80c as was suggested when one of my earlier dreams did not come thru

when swil only let it cook for 1-2hrs swinymph problem was swil problem too. try a drink bottle, salt shaker, of decrative bottles from $ stores with balloon on top then let cook for as long as swinymph can (swil knows it hard but once swinymph get something back then let cook longer!)

* IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT SWINYMPH TAKES GOTTA AND LUKKY D VERY SERIOUS AND CATCHES EVERY WORD READ THIS WHOLE THREAD OVER AND OVER THET HELPED SWIL OUT A WHOLE LOT* (now if swil can do this again and perfect it)(still don't know if the shits any good) any suggestions?

[This message has been edited by loutre bottom mistress (edited 07-02-2003).]

thanks miss...getting ready for nighty night and dream (hopefully not nightmare time!!) longer time rxn, and have read and re-read this thread enough that hopefully it sunk in and will come thru too! ya'll are great!! hopefully all will go well with your dream and mine too! we shall see!!!

couple of hrs here into my dream. just wanted to check for some add'l info. rxn is going into 3 hr. i can imagine the balloon is expanding now (at least since 1 hr 35 min). stuff in tube is darker than blood red, almost black. turning to a thick liquid of sorts. not sure when this part is complete. should stuff turn black and thick liquid, thin liquid? this is the first dream where left longer than 1 hr via nano. is this dream on track as far as this stage? by this stage, i imagine the heat, sand in can, tube in sand?

According to swim's version of the nano method, it states 1 hour....No more, no less.

At least until you get the hang of it.

this is my 4 or 5 dream here. tried 1 hr in the previous dreams and dreams turned into nightmares!! it was suggested in an earlier post on this thread to let the time go longer in my dream to see what may happen. after so many previous dreams, just wanted to have a little guidance thru this one to see if i am on the right track. not trying to be a pain in anyone's tushy. just want to turn in a complete paper in my dreams!!

Nymph...I'm sorry I had already forgot that you had said somethin like that before. Forgive me. Ok...*shaking head* Go to the post called "making the goooood stuff" and read swigotta's reply. It's dated 06/08/03.

hey all, ok, don't even know if i should post. feeling pretty stupid at this point (extremely tired too), but this little nymph needs some help! i read and read this thread numerous times, found the one "the goood stuff" read it. my next dream is like this. 3g i, 1.5g e, 3g rp. add 4 drops of dh20. left for 3hrs (balloon popped a leak)...oh no!! followed rest of instructions as imagined. clear thru 4 drops of acid. all seemed to be what i thought. evap left nothing. there was nothing there. everything w/nothing. tried some of the suggestions and still not able to find anything. now nymph is at the mercy of anyone who feels maybe just a little like helping me out. i have a whole folder full of notes and things. any little tidbits or hints would be so ever appreciated.

ps. hope all is having a good day

swinymph go to rhodium and search "geezs"

this wil take swinymph to 1 match read carefully and it tells when your honey is ready (the rp will fall out)also be sure after swinymph adds lye/water solution and swirls around let sit then drain out polar layer(bottom) then in a seperate jar drain fuel out too wash the first bottle that you are mixing the fuel and lye/water in wash real good with hot dh20 and then put the fuel back in then do two or three water washes and add little dh20 to the fuel then in another jar mix alittle murtic acid with alittle more dh2o and pour some of this in swinymph fuel and dh20 shake like hell and check ph .

* swil thinks after adding lye water and doing this step wash the bottle out completly so no more lye on the sides*

this is what sunk in and helped swil.

swil guesses the ph wasn't low enough even when it tested ok the lye still on the sides of the jar and screwing up swils hole rxn and reaction.

forgot to add don't boiling down the final meth water put in glass dish and sit in front of a small heater. thanks swigotta for that. seeing how it so hot down here swil use a heat lamp and a small fan. boiling will cause lost of product (i think)

Hey nymph just wandering how old u are and where ya from? e-mail me lbm@mailvault.com

only out of curiosity no need to reply its up to you. i'll still give my input on your posts no matter

[This message has been edited by loutre bottom mistress (edited 07-02-2003).]

Nympgh--

You need to regroup. First, go to your notebook and find the beginners synth by curbshot. You know, the soup can. The one you are using. Now, take it out of the notebook and over to your work area. Put it on the tabletop or flat surface, preferably on a chemical resistant surface. Now, get the muriatic acid that you use on your project. Open the jug and just pour it all over the papers. Now, that's much better.

I really want to help you get this straight. Please wait a few hours, as I am busy today. I will not work on any more tutoring work until this is written. I want to make this a priority.

BTW, do you have enough supplies to take another shot?

thanks gotta...

little more open-eyed and less brain mush right now...not much but a little anyhow. should have enough to try again. any help like i said would be greatly appreciated. boy the muriatic sure ate that paperwork! patiently awaiting any news.

nymph--

Gotta gogo to work. Post when I get home. Hang in there.

This thread is turning out to be a wealth of information. Switired never expected that this thread would still be alive at this point. He's made a copy of the entire thread and filed it away for safe keeping. Thanks Lucky and Gotta for contributing here, and everyone else too. Switired is also waiting for gotta to get home from work.

Swigotta,

Oh, by the way...Switired does not know the fool named rowdyrob. Switired had a few days off work and spent a long while reading. It seems that most of rowdy's posts were made one after the other and I angrily responded to most of them. I realize I should not have done that since it seemed to throw more fuel onto rowdy's fire. I apologize to acidmelt and everyone else here. And uh...Redhorse, no offense taken here bro I felt like you did and let my fingers take over. haahhahahahah



[This message has been edited by AlwaysTired (edited 07-04-2003).]

hangin in there for now....just chillin by the lake w/drink in hand...oh, and reading reading reading!!

Hey AT...sorry if Swirh offended ya...just been very hectic suffering from a moderate case of gottagoisim and Swirh's thoughts may not have been as clear as they should have been. The guy seemed to be a dick tho... and acted like a dick...so Swirh mistook him for a dick... Dunno...the bullshit tolerance level was at a premium low that day Swirh guesses... It was after he really said all the crap about AM that t hought well hell why not. Maybe he would get the hint ya know?

No offense to anyone on here...you guys have been invaluable to Swirh and he preciates all the help.. But in all fairness...the dude shoulda used his head more and not have been a dick...

Man...AT...Swirh misread the previous...(wonder how that could happen lol) and mistook Switired for (switi)Red somehow???. Thought that you were talking to me for a sec there... Now that I relook can see how I mistook the wordage. Amazing what havoc multitasking can create... Peace all..

[This message has been edited by RedHorse (edited 07-04-2003).]