I don't know who else here speaks Hebrew, but I was going over some passages about Jesus's birth in Hebrew with a colleague of mine and we found something interesting.:

In Hebrew Mary is referred to as "almah", which translates into "virgin" in Greek but means "young woman" in Hebrew which could mean virgin or not. To be sure, we checked the story of Immanuel (who was almost supposedly born from a virgin) and she was also referred to as "almah".

Therefore the whole virgin thing could just be a mistranslation.

Cheers,

Lost

I thought that has been pretty well documented, because I know I've read that before.

[This message has been edited by napoleon_complex (edited 07-13-2005).]

The mistranslation is found in the Septuagint, which a sloppy Greek translation of the Old Testament. Matthew used it to get the prophesy of Mary's virgin birth, and probably several others.

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:

I thought that has been pretty well documented, because I know I've read that before.



yes it is well documented.

i dont know that id put alot of stock in a modern hebrew text. too much interferance.

but, until the 4th century or so, the concept of an immaculate birth wasnt in the bible. it was added in to concrete the idea of divinity.

personally, i think it stands on its own quite well.

quote:Originally posted by Nihilist:

i dont know that id put alot of stock in a modern hebrew text. too much interferance.

but, until the 4th century or so, the concept of an immaculate birth wasnt in the bible. it was added in to concrete the idea of divinity.

personally, i think it stands on its own quite well.

I know, that's why we were using the scroll at the local temple. I felt like a wierdo coming in and asking for something besides the Torah, Qabala, or whatever but they had it.

Cheers,

Lost

how old was it?

im of the opinion that at this point, its pointless trying to find stuff out. too many despotic fingers have been in the pie.

if you beleive, follow your heart. thats the best you can do at this point.

hsilgne snwo werbeh

quote:Originally posted by LostCause:

I don't know who else here speaks Hebrew, but I was going over some passages about Jesus's birth in Hebrew with a colleague of mine and we found something interesting.:

In Hebrew Mary is referred to as "almah", which translates into "virgin" in Greek but means "young woman" in Hebrew which could mean virgin or not. To be sure, we checked the story of Immanuel (who was almost supposedly born from a virgin) and she was also referred to as "almah".

Therefore the whole virgin thing could just be a mistranslation.

Cheers,

LostThe fact is Almah does mean girl. And it can be used to describe a betulah, but it doesn't have to be. However the Christian gospels still describe the conception as "by the Holy spirit." The problem comes from a translation of Yesheyahu. The word used is haAlmah.

http://www.brit-torah.com/isaiah7a.htm

i just got home from work and i gotta eat and do some yardwork, so i'm not going to look anything up right now....

just throwing in my two cents..

It seems to me that the prophecy's intent is "vigin".

If the intent was "young girl" or "girl", then big deal... a birth from a girl happens all the time. Why not just say.."The Messiah will be born".

I think the intent must have been something special or extraordinary.

It's the prophetic syntax. It's always a woman shall bear a child, or a man shall get kicked in the nuts, et cetera...always active, always indirect.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

i just got home from work and i gotta eat and do some yardwork, so i'm not going to look anything up right now....

just throwing in my two cents..

It seems to me that the prophecy's intent is "vigin".

If the intent was "young girl" or "girl", then big deal... a birth from a girl happens all the time. Why not just say.."The Messiah will be born".

I think the intent must have been something special or extraordinary.

Many of the prophecies contained in the OT are not of a mystical, special, or extraordinary nature whatsoever...assuming the prophecy of the Messiah would be so is a rather baseless inference.

quote:Originally posted by The Mad Bomber:

hsilgne snwo werbeh

*laughs*

I'll call the rabbi tomorrow and find out just how old it is.

Cheers,

Lost

The rabbi told me that because there's no copywrite date there's no way to tell how old it is. All he could tell me was that it's an heirloom of the Cohen tribe and it's probably many generations old.

Cheers,

Lost

quote:Originally posted by LostCause:

I don't know who else here speaks Hebrew, but I was going over some passages about Jesus's birth in Hebrew with a colleague of mine and we found something interesting.:

In Hebrew Mary is referred to as "almah", which translates into "virgin" in Greek but means "young woman" in Hebrew which could mean virgin or not. To be sure, we checked the story of Immanuel (who was almost supposedly born from a virgin) and she was also referred to as "almah".

Therefore the whole virgin thing could just be a mistranslation.

Cheers,

Lost

The virgin mary was not a virgin after she became pregnant with jesus.







[This message has been edited by godofjacob (edited 07-16-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by LostCause:

I know, that's why we were using the scroll at the local temple. I felt like a wierdo coming in and asking for something besides the Torah, Qabala, or whatever but they had it.

LostCause, you are causing me more puzzlement every day. You are a black female working in a bar, but you also work as a mortician in your family-owned funeral parlor(*), you use to get into physical fights and barroom brawls, and now you are also Jewish with knowledge of Hebrew and Greek and a regular at your local temple.

I am getting confused. Please help me.



Edit: (*)As a matter of fact, there is actually some consistency here, as you might happen to suffuse (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=suffuse) bodies, which would be living ones on one hand and dead ones on the other, with preserving liquids.



[This message has been edited by Uncus (edited 07-16-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Uncus:

LostCause, you are causing me more puzzlement every day. You are a black female working in a bar, but you also work as a mortician in your family-owned funeral parlor(*), you use to get into physical fights and barroom brawls, and now you are also Jewish with knowledge of Hebrew and Greek and a regular at your local temple.

I am getting confused. Please help me.

LOL, although many consider the ghetto to be black, it was originally the place where Jews were required to live (in European cities)

So, here is how it could be reconciled:

she works at the

"BARmitvah pool/funeral parlor" in the ghetto.



LOL... sorry, just jive'n muthafucka.

quote:Originally posted by Uncus:

LostCause, you are causing me more puzzlement every day. You are a black female working in a bar, but you also work as a mortician in your family-owned funeral parlor(*), you use to get into physical fights and barroom brawls, and now you are also Jewish with knowledge of Hebrew and Greek and a regular at your local temple.

I am getting confused. Please help me.



Edit: (*)As a matter of fact, there is actually some consistency here, as you might happen to suffuse (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=suffuse) bodies, which would be living ones on one hand and dead ones on the other, with preserving liquids.



I live/work in my uncles old funeral home during the week and I work in a bar on the weekends. I study religion as a hobby and I don't know where the fuck you got the idea I'm black - I'm Jewish.

Cheers,

Lost