Nowadays loads of people are becoming pagans, satanists, witches and other of these cults and it just really pisses me off. I mean what kind of people believe in 'witches' who can 'curse' people?

Pagans are just as bad - there are all these perfectly good religions out there which could actually be considered believable (im atheist) and yet they decide for some stupid reason to join a religion which sacrifices animals, believe in the 'power of nature' and all that other BS. I mean this is a religion that became virtually extinct thousands of years ago - maybe because its just too uncivilised, unbelievable etc?

Satanists are also a bunch of crackpots. I mean even if the devil exists (?) why an earth would anyone want to worship him and sacrifice animals, drink blood etc. Its just an excuse for physchos to kill things. Surely if you do die you'd be guaranteed to go to hell - woop-de-fucking-doo.

Witches, im just at a loss. SURE you can 'curse' people and do 'magic' and you can talk with 'pixies' yes........

its just an excuse for insecure, delusioned people to pretend they have 'power'. Retards.

All these people are just the dregs off society, not wanting to be 'one of the masses' wanting to be 'individual' so they join some loopy sect.

Its like a disease spreading through society - it has to be destroyed.

/end of rant

quote:Originally posted by AlfMan:

All these people are just the dregs off society, not wanting to be 'one of the masses' wanting to be 'individual' so they join some loopy sect.

Its like a disease spreading through society - it has to be destroyed.

I bet many people say same things about atheists. Just take "so they join some loopy sect" away.

It's actually because they have the herd mentality every other human does. We have tendencies to band together, an instinct to form social heirarchy. These subgroups are on form of heirarchy we can be part of...the individuals involved practice hypocrisy in that they are claiming to be breaking away from the norm only to fall right back into the herd mentality. Everyone is a hypocrit in that sense, though.

quote:Originally posted by Sniper:

I bet many people say same things about atheists. Just take "so they join some loopy sect" away.

Atheism isn't a sect or any form of organization.

Atheism is the lack of theistic beliefs.

Alfman:

Nowadays loads of people are becoming pagans, satanists, witches and other of these cults and it just really pisses me off. I mean what kind of people believe in 'witches' who can 'curse' people?

The same kind of people, I imagine, who believe that people called "priests" can "change" mundane bread into the flesh of a man who rose from the dead and went up into the clouds.

Pagans are just as bad - there are all these perfectly good religions out there which could actually be considered believable (im atheist) and yet they decide for some stupid reason to join a religion which sacrifices animals, believe in the 'power of nature' and all that other BS.

Perhaps you should be informed before you draw such quick opinions, eh? Your viewpoint on how believeable religions are is heavily reliant on your society. I've, personally, never known a pagan who sacrifices animals. And, as for the power of nature, think about how powerful nature is, in fact. These people rever that fact; the mysticism is a relatively minor aspect of their belief structure, in my opinion.

I mean this is a religion that became virtually extinct thousands of years ago - maybe because its just too uncivilised, unbelievable etc?

Read some history, and you'll probably understand why the religion (actually, a very loose system, nothing like the developing influence of the Catholic Church at that time) dwindled. Complicated subject, really.

Satanists are also a bunch of crackpots. I mean even if the devil exists (?) why an earth would anyone want to worship him and sacrifice animals, drink blood etc. Its just an excuse for physchos to kill things.

Devil-worshippers and satanists are very distinct groups. You wouldn't get halfway through this if you ever met any member of the (if I remember right) Church of Satan. They'd quickly explain exactly what satanism (in the modern sense) is all about. As for devil-worshippers, why not? Everything else is worshipped, these days.

Surely if you do die... ...it has to be destroyed.

Undoubtedly, there are people out there who think that atheism is "a disease spreading through society." If everyone would just follow the classic "live and let live," it would all be goddamn fine.

edit: forgot to finish a clause/sentence.

[This message has been edited by ashesofzen (edited 05-10-2004).]

quote:Atheism is the lack of theistic beliefs.

It's not believing in any deity (oh great nothing!), but is often tied into other religions, like buddhism, modern satanism, science, scientology etc.

"Now, let's not classify all Wiccans as the same. Certainly, we must differentiate between Wiccans of Level 5 or above, and those uneducated serfs who have yet to acquire the Wizard Card."

- Lincoln "Idiot" Freimund

But seriously... Wiccan beliefs, as such, aren't any more stupid than what you'd read in the Koran or the Bhagavad Gita or the Book of Job. My problem is just that, when you question a Wiccan's beliefs, they immediately say you're persecuting them and call you a bigot. Apparently, pointing out huge holes in their belief system is the same as cackling malevolently while preparing a good-sized stake and reading from the Malleus Maleficarum. Foolishness.

Am I alone in believing that you can't take a certain set of ideas, call it a "religion," and thereby remove it from the arena of healthy criticism? My Christian buddies can take a Jesus joke. I can take a "seeya in hell, unbeliever" joke. Why do Wiccans become fire-breathing hose beasts when I ask them if Dorothy stole their Ruby Slippers?

This is obviously a troll. Nobody with enough synapses to operate a computer could be so disasterously ignorant.

quote:Originally posted by Dark_Magneto:

Atheism isn't a sect or any form of organization.

Atheism is the lack of theistic beliefs.

What I meant that those who belive can say

All these people are just the dregs off society, not wanting to be 'one of the masses' wanting to be 'individual'.

Its like a disease spreading through society - it has to be destroyed.

as well.

ok firstly, i have never in my whole 6 years as a pagan sacrified anything, or met anyone who had

Secondly paganism never actually died, it was just kept underground becasue the romans and there whole forced christianity thing came over here...

Indeed that is true. The Russian bloodline I come from is mostly Pagan, but fronted as a Christian house during most of the Renaissance Age, and 'lost faith' during the Communistic groundings and eventual rule of the 19th and 20th centuries; and it even mixes a little bit with Druidic religion, that is, if some family texts I've found and studied were accurately recording my family's history.

quote:Originally posted by Schraff:

This is obviously a troll. Nobody with enough synapses to operate a computer could be so disasterously ignorant.

Way to rebut him there, slugger.

quote:Originally posted by Schraff:

This is obviously a troll. Nobody with enough synapses to operate a computer could be so disasterously ignorant.

I've seen far more ignorance on matters that are foreign to the mind from much more intelligent people than I get the impression any of us totse uses could be. The guy may be ignorant on what it is, but he's also probably inexperienced in dealing with the occult, and would change opinions if he were to see what it really is. Chances are, his experiences with it lie on what teenagers do, as his description of it very much fits the faux beliefs that the youth of today profess. Kids see the occult as just that, the occult, and find it to be a way of showing uniquity...his experiences with the occult, atleast as it seems from his post, are with those who fake being members of the occult to stand out in some weird way. In reality though, most practitioners of the occult religions aren't very open about their beliefs...there's stigma about it in society, and mature people generally take the path of least resistance as they've already gone through the phase of rebellion, in which the mind craves resistance.

quote:Originally posted by AlfMan:

Nowadays loads of people are becoming pagans, satanists, witches and other of these cults and it just really pisses me off. I mean what kind of people believe in 'witches' who can 'curse' people?

Pagans are just as bad - there are all these perfectly good religions out there which could actually be considered believable (im atheist) and yet they decide for some stupid reason to join a religion which sacrifices animals, believe in the 'power of nature' and all that other BS. I mean this is a religion that became virtually extinct thousands of years ago - maybe because its just too uncivilised, unbelievable etc?

Satanists are also a bunch of crackpots. I mean even if the devil exists (?) why an earth would anyone want to worship him and sacrifice animals, drink blood etc. Its just an excuse for physchos to kill things. Surely if you do die you'd be guaranteed to go to hell - woop-de-fucking-doo.

Witches, im just at a loss. SURE you can 'curse' people and do 'magic' and you can talk with 'pixies' yes........

its just an excuse for insecure, delusioned people to pretend they have 'power'. Retards.

All these people are just the dregs off society, not wanting to be 'one of the masses' wanting to be 'individual' so they join some loopy sect.

Its like a disease spreading through society - it has to be destroyed.

/end of rant

Instead of flaming you, I'd just like to point out (as a Pagan) that I've never once sacrificed animals or caused any harm to any living thing during the course of my religious study. Please research the religions a little more.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Indeed that is true. The Russian bloodline I come from is mostly Pagan, but fronted as a Christian house during most of the Renaissance Age, and 'lost faith' during the Communistic groundings and eventual rule of the 19th and 20th centuries; and it even mixes a little bit with Druidic religion, that is, if some family texts I've found and studied were accurately recording my family's history.

Are you of Russian origin ? Did your ancestors belong to the Khlysti sect ?

You don't need to reply if you don't feel like.

quote:Originally posted by AlfMan:

Nowadays loads of people are becoming pagans, satanists, witches and other of these cults and it just really pisses me off. I mean what kind of people believe in 'witches' who can 'curse' people?

Pagans are just as bad - there are all these perfectly good religions out there which could actually be considered believable (im atheist) and yet they decide for some stupid reason to join a religion which sacrifices animals, believe in the 'power of nature' and all that other BS. I mean this is a religion that became virtually extinct thousands of years ago - maybe because its just too uncivilised, unbelievable etc?

Satanists are also a bunch of crackpots. I mean even if the devil exists (?) why an earth would anyone want to worship him and sacrifice animals, drink blood etc. Its just an excuse for physchos to kill things. Surely if you do die you'd be guaranteed to go to hell - woop-de-fucking-doo.

Witches, im just at a loss. SURE you can 'curse' people and do 'magic' and you can talk with 'pixies' yes........

its just an excuse for insecure, delusioned people to pretend they have 'power'. Retards.

All these people are just the dregs off society, not wanting to be 'one of the masses' wanting to be 'individual' so they join some loopy sect.

Its like a disease spreading through society - it has to be destroyed.

/end of rant



Without looking like it, you are actually touching on one of the deeper problems of existence - the impulse towards individualization and how to deal with it.

quote:Originally posted by Vampire Archimiel:

Instead of flaming you, I'd just like to point out (as a Pagan) that I've never once sacrificed animals or caused any harm to any living thing during the course of my religious study. Please research the religions a little more.

Don't you know that paganism has become politically correct ? Nowadays, being a pagan chiefly means caring about the environment, practice healing (without or without results, I couldn't tell), and do candle magic to attract love and money. Not very much what it was probably about a few hundreds, let alone a few thousands years ago. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, of course.



Edit : I haste to add : this is the public image they are trying to project anyways.



[This message has been edited by Uncus (edited 05-11-2004).]

[This message has been edited by Uncus (edited 05-11-2004).]

paganism is a VERY general term, stop speaking of it like it's catholicism.

Im not a satanist, but I googled it and read quite a bit on modern satanism, it isn't that much different from atheism also they don't actually worship 'The Devil' or the Christian version of 'Satan' read up on it if you want...

paganism is a broad belief, from those who beleive in actual magik and spirits to thosee who just see nature as a balance which deserves respect and needs protecting.

pagans do not worship the devil, this concept of 'evil' is biblical

believing that cutting down a tree or polluting a river will have negative efects on nature as a whole may seem like BS to you, but to me seems credible, weathers it's to do with spirits, life force, karma, or anything else is just detail. leave pagans alone, they are good people

I haven't read most of this thread, but I fail to see how polytheism is any different from monotheism. One god, many gods, one set of stupid rituals, another set of stupid (and in the case of most religions far more boring) rituals. If I was going fool myself into believing somthing like a lot of people seem to desperately want to, it'd be somthing interesting.

quote:I bet many people say same things about atheists. Just take "so they join some loopy sect" away.

Where I come from atheism is the norm. Actually, I'd say in most countries in the first world besides America atheism is the norm.