i was chatting with this buddy of mine the other day and he mentioned that he had been working on a logic bomb. one that according to him would be able to trash your hd by forcing the head to try read/writing across sectors of the disk that simply arent there. I have heard of these before but always thought they were bogus, i asked for his kodez but he said nuh uh till he was actually done it. dunno how much heads or tails i would have made of it cuz i'm sure something like that would have to be written in assembly/machine language right? the guy is a shitter but he does no his shit too, whats your guy's take? is he POC'ing or posing?

Logic Bombs do exist. I don't know anything about his skills, but yes you can write them. Usually, done in assembly but not always, you are essentially just causing the computer to enter a state for which it has no response programmed to handle, and thus it crashes. The idea of logic bombs are the same as writing a program, and giving it parameters it doesnt know how to handle.

Well your "buddy" is a big fat liar. A drive should check parameters before executing them, if they're out of range you'll simply get an error and it will have done nothing. If your drive did indeed try to seek to the nonexistant sector (not gonna happen unless the head and cylinder parameters are verified and valid and the drive uses data stored in address marks to locate sectors on the recording media in which case it will search for the sector but not find it and give an error and leave the head over that cylinder until moved later), it certainly would not get trashed unless you happened to have it open and smeared your hand over its platters at the same time. Direct drive controller access can be managed in higher level languages considering they often include port I/O facilities though I think he'd have no idea how to do it and probably use more high level access to sectors. If he was really writing something dangerous, I doubt he would have blabbered it to you. I think he'd have better luck damaging a hard drive by repeatedly making it spin up and down causing wear. If he's doing any direct drive access, it most likely would be to erase the master boot record or something else unoriginal.

quote:Originally posted by blip:

Direct drive controller access can be managed in higher level languages considering they often include port I/O facilities though I think he'd have no idea how to do it and probably use more high level access to sectors. If he was really writing something dangerous, I doubt he would have blabbered it to you.

so what's higher than machine language? go back to your l33t skriptz

why do you doubt he would have blabbered it to me?

o right cuz i am a simple minded teenager who doesnt no c frum perl

wrong blow me

find some other fucker worth flaming, not the dumbass u think i am...bihotch

would love to stay and embarrass you some more but i have drinks to drink and girls to girl

till i find u in the sandbox next time there blip stay clean and dont forget to wipe your ass on your pillow after daddy fills it

Actually, Blip summed it up pretty well.

quote:

so what's higher than machine language? go back to your l33t skriptz



Actually any language is higher than machine code. Machine code is referred to as a "low level" language. Programming languages such as Java or C++ are high level languages.

quote:

why do you doubt he would have blabbered it to me?

o right cuz i am a simple minded teenager who doesnt no c frum perl

wrong blow me



Or perhaps because you don't even appear intelligent enough to spell simple English words correctly. Why would anyone intelligent enough to write such a piece of code be hanging out with someone like you?

quote:

find some other fucker worth flaming, not the dumbass u think i am...bihotch



Your spelling and attitude in general really does make you appear to be a dumbass.

quote:

would love to stay and embarrass you some more but i have drinks to drink and girls to girl



You're only embarassing yourself with posts like this.

quote:

till i find u in the sandbox next time there blip stay clean and dont forget to wipe your ass on your pillow after daddy fills it



...

Sorry, I don't normally like to get involved with pointless posts like this. However, sometimes people's ignorance and immaturity bothers me to the point where I feel it's necessary to point it out, for the good of everyone.

intelligent posts deserve intelligent answers.

if he had stated anything really pertaining to the question i had stated then perhaps i would not have responded in such a fashion.

as for your wonderfully nitpicky post concerning high level vs low level programming and my simian level of intelligence based upon me responding in kind to some prick's post, then i guess you deserve the same response,

BLOW ME

and so sorry for making a fool of myself in front of such el8 doodz such as yourself.

as for my spelling and usage of l33t speak, ask santa for a sense of sarcasm

in case i forgot to respond to any of your other lady like nicely cut and pasted insults lemme throw in another,

BLOW ME!

sweet dreams there cupcake

don't let the 0day bugz bite

Question:

quote:Originally posted by rj45:

is he POC'ing or posing?

Answer:

quote:Originally posted by blip:

Well your "buddy" is a big fat liar.

Reasoning:

quote:Originally posted by blip:

A drive should check parameters before executing them, if they're out of range you'll simply get an error and it will have done nothing. If your drive did indeed try to seek to the nonexistant sector (not gonna happen unless the head and cylinder parameters are verified and valid and the drive uses data stored in address marks to locate sectors on the recording media in which case it will search for the sector but not find it and give an error and leave the head over that cylinder until moved later), it certainly would not get trashed unless you happened to have it open and smeared your hand over its platters at the same time. Direct drive controller access can be managed in higher level languages considering they often include port I/O facilities though I think he'd have no idea how to do it and probably use more high level access to sectors. If he was really writing something dangerous, I doubt he would have blabbered it to you. I think he'd have better luck damaging a hard drive by repeatedly making it spin up and down causing wear. If he's doing any direct drive access, it most likely would be to erase the master boot record or something else unoriginal.



Loser:

http://www.totse.com/bin/bbs/ubbmisc.cgi?action=getbio&UserName=rj45

You guys are all wrong.

I wrote a proof of concept that can indeed destroy a hard drive.

You can fuckup the temperature compensation so the drive keeps head banging.

Takes about an hour of this before the heads are too fucked up to read anything.

lifejunkie, any and all drives? ATA? SATA? SCSI?

No, normal IDE, we have it working for 4 different IDE controller chipsets.

It is basically a buffer overflow in how the controllers handle DMA transfers.

I will be happy when it can run on eight different chipsets.

go you...

Conclusion, life junkie rules, original poster is still a dipshit.

junkie, I know what you're talking about, and hate to dissappoint, but that's been fixed on 90% of drives made in the past couple years. (note: the following is JUST an idea, no idea if it would work) If you wanted to fuck a drive, perhaps try writing to the same (physical) location over and over again. Like 10,000 times. Just have a nice program run in the background, wait until they get a couple days of uptime. Prolly would put out a bad sector in no time.

I'd just like to point out that a logic bomb is anything that will do something malicious(?) when a condition is true (that's where the "logic" comes from, kids). This has to do with a malicious payload, so the logic bomb is completely irrelevant unless the condition is some disk access.

quote:Originally posted by rel4x:

junkie, I know what you're talking about, and hate to dissappoint, but that's been fixed on 90% of drives made in the past couple years. (note: the following is JUST an idea, no idea if it would work) If you wanted to fuck a drive, perhaps try writing to the same (physical) location over and over again. Like 10,000 times. Just have a nice program run in the background, wait until they get a couple days of uptime. Prolly would put out a bad sector in no time.

This has never been released, and works on any drive made today with the controllers that we have figured out.

If you want to start messing with the same thing, buy a brand new WD drive, and start reverse engineering the diag disk.

Found some weird use of the IDE registers.

Long story short, you can commendeer direct access to the head, move it out of normal bounds, and mess it up.

Finally some explanation as to how you figured it out! Thank you. I will try, but first I have to find the floppy and a working drive (most of mine are toast from all kinds of abuse :-/ ). And of course no one's drives will suffer damage except my own, nor will I release it (too dangerous).

Edit: Hehe I would've never thought of that. And I think I'm going to have to find a copy of the disk online, maybe, unless the bootsector is important also?

[This message has been edited by blip (edited 12-29-2004).]

Just wondering, but with an OS like XP for instance, which doesnt even let you NEAR the hardware, is it capable of even moving the head like that? Wouldn't it be something below the OS level?

Your program installs a driver that talks in ring 0.

Alrighty... I don't know if this still works, but what about parking the head and then performing a read/write operation? Wouldn't that screw up the drive?

If you park the heads by also spinning down the platters e.g. commands 0E2h and 0E6h, then a subsequent read/write command will spin it back up for the operation unless you have some more direct control. Now doing this will introduce considerable delays compared to the immediately accessible state, and when my 1.2 GB Seagate drive executes command 0E6h it rarely spins back up upon access by Windows causing the system to freeze although my other drives do spin up from that state. Hmm... don't know about that one.