Edit: My friends read on Totse, I don't know how much I want them knowing.

[This message has been edited by Black Flag (edited 03-16-2004).]

Hey BF, haven't seen you in a while.

Yo, elf.

Eloquence is often mistaken for truth. Your friend sounds very convincing, but only you make your own decisions. Seeking advice is healthy, but not relying on it. That's why lawyers are tricky little bastards. They are all gifted with words.. they can convince you and everyone else that you didn't commit a crime even if you very well know you did, and likewise for the opposite.. be wary of eloquence.

Hell, don't trust anything.

Sex has yet to create that amazing bond between me and my partners, perhaps because of the mindset we go into it with. However, it has yet to ruin my life or regret any of my decisions.

Somehow I've managed to think through things thouroughly, make decisions that don't always turn out as planned, but take the good with the bad and not regret anything. Consequences come with everything.

Sex can be as life-altering as you make it.

Apologies, my mind starts to wander off topic easily...

Another thing I've learned/experienced. Relationships will always equal some amount of pain. Ending the relationship now, later, never... you'll hurt each other somehow. You can't escape that.

And you can't escape hindsight.

Maybe one day I won't be so bitter :\ <3

[This message has been edited by hakaidojojo (edited 03-16-2004).]

quote:Originally posted by Black Flag:

A little more than two months ago I started going out with this amazing girl. One of the most beautiful things I've ever laid my eyes on, and we get along really well. She's going to be 15 in May and I'm going to be 18 in July...

that is where i left off. that's your problem. i am going to be 20 in may and a girl that i am dating is going to be 18 in July or August(i think). but your going to be graduating on her freshman year.

quote:Originally posted by SBTlauien:

that is where i left off. that's your problem. i am going to be 20 in may and a girl that i am dating is going to be 18 in July or August(i think). but your going to be graduating on her freshman year.

Well actually she's a sophmore now, she skipped a grade, just to be technical about it.

I don't consider her inferior because of age. She's smarter, wiser, and more mature than most of the girls that I know my age. We've never really had a problem between the two of us with age.

Although there are minor issues I've had with her age, I'm not going to discuss them here nor are the relevant to the topic.

why bother going in to a realationship if not to learn something. ur friend is sounds like an anti-social dick. the only way you can avoid pain and change is to stay at home watching tv never meeting anybody.

the possiblity of a bit of pain in the end is worth it for the pleasure and experiance you will gain because of ur relationship.

quote:Originally posted by Black Flag:



... what I really want to know is these things:

Are teenagers mature, wise, responsible, and mentally/emotionally secure enough to handle a sexual relationship?

Are teenagers ready for serious long term relationships that realistically won't end up in a marriage?

Will the pain in the end of our relationship be worth the great experience I have with this girl that I love?

Can I have a relationship with this girl that we can both look back upon without bad feelings?



Well, first of all, it's important to point out that if your friend is a Witness, part of his feelings of devastation are because of the fact that he feels he's committed a sin in addition to all the emotional pain of being rejected.

It's worth mentioning that there is a thread on the pros and cons of religion in relationships ... I'd encourage you to read it at your leisure:

http://www.totse.com/bbs/Forum4/HTML/006678.html

Your friend's reasoning that 'sex before marriage is immoral' and his further reasoning that it is 'inevitable' and that you would regret it later are all questionable points to make -- he's not in the situation after all; you are. He also believes that you should break off the relationship sooner rather than later because of how much harder it would be after the time had passed. Again -- questionable.

It sounds, to be honest, like your friend is trying to justify his actions to you in the hope that he can absolve himself of some of the guilt he's feeling. Since you don't necessarily share his views, I wouldn't take everything he suggests at face value.

Anyway, here are my answers to your core questions:

1) I would say that most teenagers younger than 18 are not mature enough to handle a sexual relationship. From a statistics viewpoint, the vast majority of relationships started at 17 and under are doomed to fail simply because of the lack of life experience involved. Losing one's virginity (a profound experience, to say the least) is often enough to change one's perspective on the relationship and cause problems.

2) Teenagers (again, under 18) aren't ready for serious long-term dating which will eventually end up in marriage. This is one of the reasons why, for example, it's encouraged for young teens to date as freely as they like -- it allows them to sample experiences and ideas so that when they do marry, they get it right the first time. The idea is to be happily married, not quickly.

3) Yes. It won't feel that way, but it will be worth it. Especially if you know that you treated her with love all the way through and tried to work things out, and maybe even parted ways in an amicable fashion.

4) Absolutely. Treat her well, respect her, do all the things you say you're going to do, and talk honestly about any problems you're having with her.

In summary:

Your friend was burned -- what happened to him may not necessarily happen to you.

You love this woman. Like you've stated, you plan to respect her moral/religious wishes and wait until she's ready.

If something were to happen, you believe that it would only happen with due consideration and mutual consent, and even then if you believed she was sincere.

So, all other things being equal, you're probably in for a wait of another few years before she's ready. I'd say, let her get out of high school first. Hug her, kiss her, pleasure her all you want, but perhaps the sex itself could wait for a bit. I think you'll find it'll be worth it.

Actualy I this just kind of happened to me in the last 2 months i was 18 she was 15 here are my answers



Are teenagers mature, wise, responsible, and mentally/emotionally secure enough to handle a sexual relationship?

No they arent. My ex gf wanted it really bad, when i gave it to her she freaked out and kinda made me feel guilty like i made her. She isnt mature because she is always talking about how her friends kicked some kids ass and thoguht that was so cool. she was defenatly not emotionaly stable because if i said something she could and would turn it in to i hated her.



Are teenagers ready for serious long term relationships that realistically won't end up in a marriage?

NO my ex gfs have planed out or life before, not all but a few. my last one broke up with me cause i have to move in june 14th after i graduate. that was 2 months ago, and 6 months before i really moved.

Will the pain in the end of our relationship be worth the great experience I have with this girl that I love?

Maybe I know i wouldnt trade a moment with that girl, but at the same time i hate her with the burning passion of 1000 fires on the mount. ( i heard that in a movie), I still miss her at the same time, she put me throught a lotof shit.

Can I have a relationship with this girl that we can both look back upon without bad feelings?

no, if you talking about being friends after derfanatly not. They are crazy those younguns, not stable at all.

quote:Originally posted by Shiantar:

Losing one's virginity (a profound experience, to say the least)

what a bunch of bullshit.

quote:

Originally posted by Shiantar:

Losing one's virginity (a profound experience, to say the least)



Originally posted by mrman383:

what a bunch of bullshit.

Do you disagree?

I mean, it's perfectly natural to think less and less of those 'normal' dating relationships you had in the distant past, but everybody remembers the first person they had sex with.

Therefore it's profound.

quote:Originally posted by Shiantar:

Do you disagree?

I mean, it's perfectly natural to think less and less of those 'normal' dating relationships you had in the distant past, but everybody remembers the first person they had sex with.

Therefore it's profound.

i remember the first one no more than the second or 3rd or 4th and so on.

..the first person I had sex with was a hooker..in the back of her pimps car..with him telling me to hurry up(as I was prematurely ejaculating in my pants)..alas, a memory I'd rather forget!..

quote:Originally posted by smitty:

..the first person I had sex with was a hooker..in the back of her pimps car..with him telling me to hurry up(as I was prematurely ejaculating in my pants)..alas, a memory I'd rather forget!..

damn, that's weird. i lost mine to a girl that i was in love with and she was in love with me. my childhood was good but i still use drugs a lot. i couldn't imagine losing mine to a hooker.

quote:Originally posted by Mortis:

. the only way you can avoid pain and change is to stay at home watching tv never meeting anybody.



Are you insulting me ?

I don't actually read Threads (except for the first few posts) until AFTER I post, but here it goes:

Flag,

Don't Worry, Be Happy!

High School relationships should be about fun, dont' worry about what was or what may be, just have fun at the moment.

As I said before:

Relationships will never end well

Someone will breakup with someone else

Or someone will die before a break up can occur

So just enjoy every momment of this relationship and when it's over (not IF)

just be happy you could share your life with someone.

-Bliss-

Steve, do you know that I like you?

Well, I was hoping for a male/male relationship, but then you got a gf!

Jk,

Anyway one more tidbit:

Life IS pain,

Without pain,

Life would be boring

Well I didn't mean "like" in a romantic way.

No Shit?

"I fucked the queen,

I fucked bach,

I've even sucked an old man's cock,

So what?"

quote:Originally posted by mrman383:

i remember the first one no more than the second or 3rd or 4th and so on.

I suppose everybody is entitled to their view, but I'd hate to think what your first lover would think if they heard your first time with them reduced to 'just another drop in the bucket.'