Ok, I'll try to keep this short. There is this chick in germany, before I moved here we hit it off pretty well. Her friends were all telling me how, if I hadn't left, she would've hooked up with me and shit. And she was always like "well, maybe if you had stayed here, you would have a girlfriend now"

for the logical thinker, and obvious case right? She digs me.

Well then the other day I visited and she didn't know if she wanted to see me cuz she was all like "I almost kissed you last time, and I just don't want us to be like that" as in having a distance relationship. So that just adds to it right? She digs me.

Well now, she's all like "oh no, I always just wanted you as a friend. Why would you think I wanted more. Bla bla I never liked you that way"

basically, WHAT THE FUCK?

all her friends are like "dude, no clue."

I am at my wisdom's end!! Why would she suddenly change her mind so drastically?

chicks are like that...the best defense is a good offense...learn how to fuck with her head

she's played you for a fool

german girls for ya

well, I might add that it seems like she has been crushing on this other dude who is older and doesn't like her for like 2 years. But still, I mean, she doesn't seem like the kind of chick who would fuck with me for fucking's sake, you know? And it did seem like she really really liked me, I mean all her friends were like "yeah dude.." all my friends were like "isn't it obvious?" and I was like "seems like it"

but fuck, now she's all like "where do you get the idea that I ever wanted you as more than a friend" she seems to think that when you post shit like "I want to kiss you" it doesn't mean anything. stupid whore.

forget her, for she knows not what she does.

it's fucking pissing me off as well. Because now she's making it look like i was this lovesick puppy who's been following her around the whole time, when really I was just returning the affection she showed me.

quote:Originally posted by RIGHTEOUS IMPIETY:

forget her, for she knows not what she does.

I think she does.

quote:Originally posted by RIGHTEOUS IMPIETY:

forget her, for she knows not what she does.

This is the wisest thing said here. Other than this, it is not useful to speculate and make assumptions, 'cause the best one could do in that regard is project their own behavioral tendencies on someone else. This could lead you to having a bull-headed, jaded opinion of people.

None of us knows this girl; all we know is your side and your perspective. That last comment about "oh, I just wanted you as a friend" could be a face-saving tactic, PMS, demonic possession, immature capriciousness or, as Righteous suggested, her own delusional belief.

When she pulled the "friends" thing, did you call her on it right there and then? Did you ask, "what's up with all the stuff you said before about wanting to kiss me, and you would have been my gf, etc.?"

Also, it sounds like you relied heavily on unreliable second-hand sources (her friends, your friends) to "confirm" her feelings before.

You could be a scoundrel and learn to fuck with people's minds "before they can fuck with you, hrumph!" Or, you can learn to be straightforward and go to the source to find out a girl's affections and intentions. Sincerity goes a long way. At least, guys in fulfilling, mature relationships might see it that way.

Thanks for your opinion Cindy, I value it greatly. Well, of course you'll only hear my account. Whereas even without the second hand sources, I would still have made the assumption that she was a little more serious. I called her on it, whereas I had to realize today that she isn't as mature (in my opinion, obviously) as I had thought. She didn't feel the need to explain anything to me and got mad everytime I said how she was contradicting herself. I just wondered if, perhaps, this had happened to someone before.

The only thing she said was that she wasn't sure about her feelings at the time. I guess that's valid, but it is fucking weird. She's been chasing after this older guy for 2 years and he has shown no interest in her whatsoever (and will not) and yet she chooses to pursue him. Screwed again charlie brown -

Well, this really botheres me because she's been the first girl I've openend up to in a long time. Now it seems like she was just fucking around and I feel like she didn't deserve any of the affection I showed her (in response to her own affection, I might add.) For a usually introverted person like myself to finally find someone who you think is right for you and then to find out that they aren't, well it's just frustrating you know?

[This message has been edited by Geenie (edited 01-19-2004).]

Yeah, keep assuming she could be innocent. That assumption could not possibly hurt you. You don’t need to seduce her. She will stop lusting for what she cannot have as soon as she realizes how much you love her. In love, it is always important to keep trying the same strategy over and over and expecting different results because it is the right thing to do. And if anyone seems to be unfair, they are probably just confused, but don’t you be unfair because that makes you a scoundrel. In fact, only you can be the scoundrel. Never her. Unless of course she admits it. You should go to her and ask her if she wants to admit it. That is the best advise I can give you.

boo

[This message has been edited by Geenie (edited 01-20-2004).]

what makes you think i have a problem? go ahead and keep wondering why things don't seem to work. you'll learn.

If you're not willing to help or give your criticism in a serious form I'd appreciate if you just left this thread alone.

I'm not trying to whine (though I am) it's just that I was really surprised that I don't know how to handle this.

[This message has been edited by Geenie (edited 01-19-2004).]

I did help. I gave you great advice. If you just wanted to hear a specific thing, you should have mentioned that.

If you need it spelled out, here ya go:

Your lady friend is exhibiting a type of passive aggressive behavior. She knows what she told you before and her making you feel that you are a confused love sick puppy is something that is not lost on her. What you don’t know for sure is why she is doing it. I do agree with Cindy that you cannot know her motives for sure, but her conclusion about what she should do about it is incorrect. Any psychologist will tell you that when you confront a passive aggressive behavior, it is a mistake to respond to the motive or even to try to ascertain it. The trap of passive aggressive behavior is based on them disguising the motive, and you focusing on it gives them their power over you. Instead, you judge the action for what it is regardless of motive. If she was unfair, abusive, misleading, or whatever, that is what happened. She should be a responsible person just like you and can clear up miscommunications or apologize for anything she wishes. If you give a passive aggressive an out, they will take it every time. That is what they were looking for in the first place. If you allow her to act like your idea she was interested was all your fault for being stupid and she had nothing to do with it, she will allow you to think that.

So what does that mean you should do? A professional would advise that you confront the behavior directly. Don’t go ask her why she said what she said. Go to her, point out that she was misleading, and tell her you don’t appreciate that and you will not put up with it. Is that good advice? Depends on how you look at it. It will stop passive aggressive behavior dead in its tracts and keep you from being a victim. However, most women have some level of ulterior motives at some point. You cannot avoid it completely. You have to learn how to deal with it if you want to score.

Now, why is your girl behaving this way? Can’t say for sure, but my money is on what I alluded to earlier. It sounds like she wants what she cannot have. That is very normal. At the time she said she was interested in a round about way to you, she could not have you. Now that she can have you, she is not so interested, but is interested in someone else she cannot have. If she got him, chances are she would lose interest in him rather quickly. That is just how things work. If you want to learn how to use that to your advantage, I suggest reading the seduction archive. If you want to ignore the way she is behaving and hope she changes her behavior patterns for no particular reason and “does the right thing” then go to her and be direct. However, when it is obvious that she is deliberately hiding the reality of the situation, I don’t think that is a good strategy at all.



[This message has been edited by Easy Going (edited 01-19-2004).]

Thank you. Well, you see, that's where you are wrong. She can't have me at the moment - firstly because I am obviously in a different country than her. Second I played it out. That's why it surprises me at all. It's not like it didn't occur to me that maybe I just got "too easy" for her, but that would be a misconception on her side. I've read a lot about seduction whereas half of the stuff on the internet is bullshit. If you can recommend anything that perhaps I haven't read I would be thankful.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/Archives/Archive-000002/HTML/20031016-4-004598.html

Here is the seduction archive. The reference I gave to Robert Greene's book is something you should look at if you want more.

thanks man, I appreciate it. I hadn't heard of that book yet.

maybe she actually likes you and took your leaving a lot harder than you think and just doesn't want to go through it again. mind you, that's not going to help her at all. she'll be kicking herself for months if she really did like you that much.

So, what would you guys generally suggest in a situation like this if one wants to get the attraction back. Yes, I have problem articulating myself on totse ^^

quote:Originally posted by Geenie:

well, I might add that it seems like she has been crushing on this other dude who is older and doesn't like her for like 2 years. ... And it did seem like she really really liked me ... stupid whore.



do you know the german word Ersatz?

You know, I totally dig a girl for like 1.5 years now, from the very first moment I saw her. Any other girl can´t replace her. If you knew before about the other guy, you just burned your fingers ...

Yeah I know what Ersatz means. But how do you mean am I a replacement? You mean, because I live in another country or because I got boring or both? Well, I wasn't really able to understand what you were trying to say in your post. Care to clarify?

Sup Zack Hooper :-D

quote:Originally posted by Geenie:

Care to clarify?

she likes the older guy, and when she loves him for 2 years now, she has really deep feelings for him. She dreams of him, fantasizes how he kisses, how he holds her in his arms. She wants to be with him.

And then there´s you. She likes you. She gives a chance for a flirt between you and her. She allows you to come closer. She might forget the other guy. But there´s no chance that you´re close to her forever. Because you leave. So when you´re not there, she´ll dream of the other guy again ...

Ok well, she always wants to talk to me like we're "friends" now but I'm really just not sure where all this comes from. Even though I could just tell her to cut the shit and why the hell she is acting this way, it would ruin all my chances of getting with her. I sort of need to go into hybernation mode so that when I come back she'll be like "oh I want to know what he looks like now" but basically, I don't know how to act or what to say to get her to shut up or w/e. If i tell her I don't want to talk to her she'll obviously take it the wrong way. So basically I'm asking what would you guys do if you were in my skin. Don't forget that I would actually prefer having a chance later on than just blowing her off.

[This message has been edited by Geenie (edited 01-25-2004).]

sorry but I need some advice here ppl *bump*

If she's under the age of 25, best way to build interest for you inside her thoughts is to ignore her. She'll wonder what's up, she'll miss you, and she'll eventually want you to be around more. Young girls are confused as can be, except maybe the one in a million case.

I suggest finding a woman at home, and if things go wrong there, find another. Don't play their mind games unless you can kick their mind's ass in them...and as you're coming to the internet for relationship advice, I assume she's more intellectually fit for mind games.

Well I'm not sure if she's actually playing it out or just really that weird. Chances are she doesn't know what she wants. At the same time though I think she's lying to herself when she says that she never felt anything for me. Well, I would just ignore her, problem is though she's really into the "I want us to be friends" thing... so how can I tell her that I don't want to talk to her? I mean, once I'm back in germany I'm sure I can handle the shit. But if I just told her that I didn't want to talk to her she'd just think that I'm weird and an asshole... you know what I mean?