Multiculturalism is bascially the view that all cultures around the world are equal, so one can just hold them to be no better or no worse.

That is a dumb idea. Bascially an idea made up by liberals and is taught as docrine in all of America's schools, and might as be the psuedo-religion of California.

How can one compare gang culture to let's say...hospital culture? To a multi-culturalist, they are equal because they offer different things.

IN light of the recent attack on America, I find it impossible for a fair minded amount of Americans to believe that there are people that hate our culture. They hate it's openess and our ability to say anything we want.

Here in Los Angeles in places like the Federal building and UC Berkeley there are actually people protesting future U.S. military action! Let's compare the culture of countries like Sudan, Libya, Iran, Afganistan, Iraq. Let's compare the morality of their culture to that of the United States...Who is kinder? Who has more freedom? Who has a lowered 'state'?

WHo has the higher amount of governmental murder? They are no worse than the Nazis. The Nazis killed all those that opposed them, and the Taliban practices the same. They kill those that oppose them.

IN the 40's and 50's we had no problem denouncing Nazi culture and praising Democratic culture, why can't we do it now? Especially now, because of how fined tuned our culture is, it therefore is easy to cripple, you can't cripple afganistan, it's already crippled.

THis is a time for Americans to be vigilant, not paranoid, and certainly not racist.

*Applause*

*bow*

*exits with Winki in arm*

That's all very well and good, but I have a feeling that all the facts aren't under your command.. Personally I don't feel I know enough about the Taliban, or anything else like that.. But I think you're wrong with your perception of multiculturalism and the idea that all cultures are equal.. Although on the face of it, that may be what is taught in america, I think it's far from the truth.. Take communism for example.. America seems in general to hold the idea that communism is bad, without exception, and thus any country that practices it is bad too..

So what culture should we all conform to?

Suz: Maybe I was typing too fast, but I was trying to say that cultures AREN"T equal. Thank you for agreeing.

Redrover: The country that you move to, motherfucker. Ex: America. You want to live off our culture that makes for a nice living, you adapt to our culture, or stay the fuck out. Love it or leave it, Frenchie.

I wasn't agreeing, I was saying your basic premise that that is what America is taught and what america believes is false..

I am so sick of the liberal-hippie-communist-politiaclly correct bullshit. It's totally opposite of what the world needs, and it must be stopped. I mean, consider this: In our society, it is illegal to acknowledge god outsidde the church or home, Yet the east indians and american indians(oh, i'm sorry, it's "first nations" now) can celebrate the "international day of ganeesh" or teach evil satanist crap like "shapeshifting" and "re-incarnation". and what's the fucking deal with "k'waanza" or however you spell it?

Exactly, America has always been multi-ethnic (even when it was 90% white) but always uni-cultural.

Hector Chan:

Here are some links for you:
http://www.fairus.org/html/04137705.htm http://www.fairus.org/html/04152803.htm http://www.fairus.org/html/04110608.htm http://www.fairus.org/html/04131611.htm

You can say you love God all you want in public. You CAN'T teach the Bible as truth in schools or use it to make laws, just as with any other religion. Calling shape-shifting and belief in reincarnation satanic is just stupid.

This forum could also be called the Ministry of Truth.



[This message has been edited by Lokil (edited 10-11-2001).]

they have a link to totse
www.minitru.org

So if you live in a certain country, you have to conform to the original culture of that country, right?

Well if are willing to leave your culture for another that you find more appealing than your own, why wouldn't you?

So why don't americans start acting like American-Indians? They were here first, right?

not any more than Italians should start speaking latin or modern Islamic egyptians sould start building temples to Ra. The culture that the Indians lived in is throughout the US dead wheras the Anglo democratic culture is stil very much alive. Furthermore the anglo democratic culture is a source of far greater prosperity and internal stability than that of the Indians.

all hail lokil!

Multi-culturalism is the opposite of what people claim. They say it is to protect diversity of cultures, but all it really does is extract the least discipline, most hedonistic elements, the lowest parts, of all cultures and combine them into one sick egalitarian blend of politically correct anti-man bullshit. Ever hear about the warrior cults of any of the Eastern religions being pushed on people? Ever hear about the normal side of things we would relate to? Of course not, the lowest and most destructive elements are exaggerated, to "celebrate diversity" but to ultimately end it, to create a global monoculture of high finance capitalism and feminist bullshit.
I am a multi-culturalist.

Your not a multi-culturist you idiot - you are just as bad. You believe that culture is defined by race and geneology....so by that definition you blend ALL cultures of one geneology just like the people you are bitching about.

wtf are you talking about? Italins, Greeks, watever don't hold alliances to their home nations, and could give a fuck.

>>>Your not a multi-culturist you idiot - you are just as bad. You believe that culture is defined by race and geneology....<<<<

It is. That would mean, Id like to see Italians acting Italian, Spaniards acting Spanish, Mexicans acting Mexican, Germans acting German, Hindus acting Hindu, etc.

>>>>so by that definition you blend ALL cultures of one geneology just like the people you are bitching about.<<<

How the hell do you figure that? How can you conclude that because I think race and ethnicity are intimately connected that Id like to see a blend of "geneology"? I dont even follow that logic. I still dont get it at all. Could you explain?

You fool. In a Multicultural society, all different ways of living, thinking and worshipping is accepted. Gangsta culture? what the fuck is that.
Before the war many countries had an assimilation policy, whereby new immagrants were forced to conform to mainstream culture, they had to leave all their ways of life and relegions behind. Multiculturalism was introduced to stop that. It welcomed the diversity of what others people had to offer. What kind of society do you want?
Are you actually going to blame the worlds problems on multiculturalism. Fuckwit.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Droogian:
You fool. In a Multicultural society, all different ways of living, thinking and worshipping is accepted. Gangsta culture? what the fuck is that.
Before the war many countries had an assimilation policy, whereby new immagrants were forced to conform to mainstream culture, they had to leave all their ways of life and relegions behind. Multiculturalism was introduced to stop that. It welcomed the diversity of what others people had to offer. What kind of society do you want?
Are you actually going to blame the worlds problems on multiculturalism. Fuckwit.

---

First of all multi-cultualism doesn't exist perpetually. After a period of time, one consumes the other. There's a world for it, but it leaves me at the moment.

I also have a new concept for you. Why do you think immigrants immigrate? To create a sub culture with political coup capabilites in the future? No. They don't. THey want to fit in and be apart of the whole. You don't love your wife SOLELY because of her values, you love her WHOLE person. Who she is, her race, her everything. Same way with countries.

Multi-cultualism is a liberal, superficial way to try and deal with mass, third and second world immigration. Nothing more, nothing less. I am so thankful I don't go to primary or intermediate schools anymore. The tension is everywhere and it's so fucking evident in the school shootings that have been so rampant. American was NEVER multicultural is the mainstream sense, we're always been multi-ethnic, even when we where 90% white.

Multu-culturalism as you put it sets up a senario were all ethnic and cultural groups retreat to their own groups of narrow self interest, and grap at each other's throat for power, the winner being able to suppress the rest. Pretty picture huh? When Whites became a minority in my state, I was fucking shicked to find out that "European Fire Fighter Assocaitions' have laready been forming.

Multi-culturalism is fun, huh? Think Bosnia is fun? How about lebanon or some parts of the former Soviet Union.

To me there are two types of liberals, or anti-Americans. THe Devious ones, that know exactly what they're doing, and the ones like Droogian, who are trueless clueless to the evil they are committing for what htey belive is 'goodness' Sad, indeed, and what a barave new world. I'm onyl 20, with plenty of work to do...

Holy fuck. I have never read such melodramatic bullshit in my entire life.

"I'm onyl 20, with plenty of work to do.."

And what work is that exactly? Sit around and play with your computer. Or are you handing out pamphlets on the evils of other relegions. Or planning to overthrow the government and make laws of one relegion, one race. SO we can all be good happy campers and follow what they say we should do. U fucking Nazi.
Fuck man, How can MULTICULTIRALISM have anything to do with racial tension. What you're talking about is fucking immagration. If you want to stop these "fueding minorities" then the "problem" isn't multi-culturalism, it's immagration. Multicultiralism is an offset of people coming over here.
And people come here not to fit in, they come here for a better life, and in consequence try to fit in.
For fucks sake, what does worshiping Allah have to do with a white guy beating up a Muslim. Nothing, he'd do it anyway. If there were less people like you who find it SO hard to get along with other ethnic groups then there wouldn't be "tension". Pull your head out and instead of trying to cause problems, try and find some solutions. Multiculturalism is here to stay. It can't be helped, no matter how loudly you and your redneck friends yell.

And Bosnia? Soviet Union? The reason they're all so fucked is because they didn't take on the same ideals as other countries.

Our better life is a result of our superior culture. Im sorry but if your don't have indoor plumbing and copper wiring your culture is not my equal.

What about gold or silver wiring?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Droogian:
Holy fuck. I have never read such melodramatic bullshit in my entire life.

"I'm onyl 20, with plenty of work to do.."

And what work is that exactly? Sit around and play with your computer. Or are you handing out pamphlets on the evils of other relegions. Or planning to overthrow the government and make laws of one relegion, one race. SO we can all be good happy campers and follow what they say we should do. U fucking Nazi.
Fuck man, How can MULTICULTIRALISM have anything to do with racial tension. What you're talking about is fucking immagration. If you want to stop these "fueding minorities" then the "problem" isn't multi-culturalism, it's immagration. Multicultiralism is an offset of people coming over here.
And people come here not to fit in, they come here for a better life, and in consequence try to fit in.
For fucks sake, what does worshiping Allah have to do with a white guy beating up a Muslim. Nothing, he'd do it anyway. If there were less people like you who find it SO hard to get along with other ethnic groups then there wouldn't be "tension". Pull your head out and instead of trying to cause problems, try and find some solutions. Multiculturalism is here to stay. It can't be helped, no matter how loudly you and your redneck friends yell.

And Bosnia? Soviet Union? The reason they're all so fucked is because they didn't take on the same ideals as other countries.

---

I'll talk to you when you learn to read.

If they have gold or silver wire there too damn wasteful. In that gold wiring is unnecessary to power transmition and is necessary only in electronic devices. but if they had enough of it to put it towards such aims and not have to worry about theft go forit.

[This message has been edited by Alan Smithee (edited 12-18-2001).]

It is easy to understand why people hate America. The recent attacks were more of a metaphoric attack on capitalism. Capitalism is basically an illusion that people have control over their lives and destiny when they actually don't. Either you conform and work for someone else or you fall by the wayside. The manipulation of public opinion by the media, as well as keeping a large % of the population rich, healthy and happy keeps these people in power. If you are strong, everything is going for you; if you are weak, you will struggle. The heirarchical system makes it impossible for any one person to change it.

The communist ideology is good in theory, but in practice it would never work; mainly because it is in our nature to want to have more money, prettier wife, faster car etc. than our neighbour. Another downfall is that one man's hard earned fortune couldn't be passed ontohis kids. "A slave begins by demanding justice and ends by wearing a crown."

If you look at the inequality in the world, although the likes of the taliban are evil, they are causing harm to less people than global capitalism. Immigration is a result of this unequal relationship America(and western Europe) has with the rest of the world. It is also the chickens of imperialism coming home to roost. Multiculturalism is just a term used to keep the population efficient, accepting new people, and so not having to question the negative effects it will have on their life. It is also a theory of Darwinism that people prefer to stick to people with people who are genetically closely related to them. My point? Building barriers, covering up history and exploitation with a large dosage of ignorance has created these problems, which we have to put up with. We can only hope we can make the world a fairer place for our children.

let me guess, you bought every thing your teachers told you.

I don't believe it all. I just agree with most of it. I'm sick of this bullshit. Just because they are in authority dosn't necessarily mean that they want to fuck you over with lies for christsake. The gov't isn't plotting a secret mission to KILL YOU. YOU DON't MaTTER!
I just don't understand what you people have against multiculturalism. So i get to each rice instead of BBQ every day, big fucking deal.

And another thing. U think that i should believe the dilusional Bullshit of that bigot Lokil (who masks his true racism with all this fucking BS). fuck man who's listening to who. Some people will follow anyone if it's not "conforming".

Im not saying that a little cultural diversity is a bad thing, however when you live in an english speaking nation you should be able to speak english. Instead you have programs teaching students in spanish. wasting money to give them a second class education, a much better option is english emmersion classes, which allow them to speak the english language and have an education on par with their peers. However the liberal "appologists" feel that this is assimilationist.

Just call me Marx....Karl Marx. I wish teachers did teach stuff like that, that's my own opinion, based on what i've read, heard and guessed. I think multi-culturalism is just something we will have to put up with, but only to an extent. When you begin to become the minority, in a country your relatives have fought to defend, it does start to get uncomfortable. Ethnic minorities do seem to commit a disproportionate amount of crime and a lot of ignorant white people also seem to embrace their cultures. If you just keep doing what you're doing, don't let anyone compromise your morals or opinions then you have nothing to fear.

You narrow minded dolt. The main reason that schools offer and encourage languages other than English is not so that you can finally have a conversation with that weird Spanish guy down the street.
Languages are offered so that students can COMMUNICATE with people from around the globe. If you plan on living in your own little world for the rest of your life, be my guest. But if you plan on travelling to other countries and not look like a faggot tourist, or becoming a businessman with world connections, or just to be more, then that�s y u learn it.

But I do agree with you on that other point. New immigrants should at least be asked to learn English. It would make life a hell of allot easier. (Assimilation isn�t just about language, it�s everything).

And another thing. Everyone seems to forget that WE ARE a multicultural society and have been for years, years before you were born. And it is most likely to be the only type of �society� you have ever known. So you can�t really talk about them �good old days� can you? When you say that immigrants should �assimilate� then that doesn�t make sense. Not anymore. Not when it�s been this way for so long. Multiculturalism IS our friggin� culture.

One last thing.
How can you say that crime is based on ethnicity? As you all know, it�s poverty that causes crime. In the 1920s when the new Americans were not Mexican/Arab/Vietnamese, they were Jews/Italians. And in the 1920s most of the crimes were committed by the poorest people, the people living in the ghettos, the Irish/Jews/Italians. NOW however, the blacks are no longer slaves with no freedom and the new immigrants are Mexicans etc.

You are a dumb mother fucker but you make up for it by talking to much. Im talking about ESL a program that teaches spanish speaking students in spanish, not foreign language programs.

shit, my bad. Fuckit anyway. Apart from all that shit I wrote in the first paragraoh the rest still applies to all that shit loki,you and that last guys was sayin'

Okay, so i misinterpreted what you said. But i'm not sure what ESL is like in America, but in Australia, ESL is used to teach english to non english speakers. And it's alot easier to teach english to someone in their own language. right?

No, Esl Is a program that teaches them all subjects in spanish its 12-k as opposed to teaching them english one year and incorporating them into regular classes.

ESL is English as a Second Language, a program for those people who learn English as a non-native tongue, as stated above.

ESL Teaches them in spanish causing them to have a less firm grasp of the english language. Furthermore it slows down the more gifted students among the latino's and prevents them from taking more advanced classes. Whereas an english emmersion class would allow them to be part of the normal school community after one year of intensive english education in their formative years.

Maybe that's how you interpret ESL as the program in California. Why must individual interpretations be taken as the only and ultimate truth?

are you intentionaly being obscure because you don't like to admit you're wrong?

ESL teaches English to non-native speakers. The medium of instruction is also English.

[This message has been edited by MesserschmidtBf109 (edited 12-28-2001).]

not here.

IT teaches english as one course of many and imparts only rudimentary fluency.

[This message has been edited by Alan Smithee (edited 12-28-2001).]

In what has turned into something of a ritual on many campuses, the conservative California Patriot had an entire press run of its newspaper stolen from its Berkeley campus office, with editors received harassing phone calls and even death threats. The theft was carried out in response to the newspaper's investigation into the student-funded Movimiento Estudiantil Chicano de Aztlan (MEChA), a radical Hispanic group that repeatedly refers to white people as gringos in its literature, calls for revolutionary liberation of the bronze continent by the bronze people, and maintains a website (aztlan.org) that features a great deal of anti-Semitic rhetoric. The Patriot has had its papers stolen twice in the past year and had many of its sponsored speakers shouted down, with little response from university officials.

I know a good many people that loathe 'american' culture...

quote:

---

Originally posted by DoPesTeR-DaZe:
I know a good many people that loathe 'american' culture...

---

Yae, so do I.

I'm not a big fan of multiculturalism, but it's far better than the alternative.

Assimilate, resistance is futile. If you don't want to, move to Lebanon or the Balkans. If that's what you mean by the 'alternative'

I'm a bit confused. You see Lokil said that you should conform to the original culture of a certain country meaning that everybody in north america should conform to an american-indian culture while Alan Smithee said that we should conform to the white american culture because it is "a source of far greater prosperity and internal stability than that of the Indians" or, in other words, better.

So who's right? Should we conform to the original culture or to the better culture?

According to most of your biased threads, it's no wonder your always confused. I hope you don't live your life this way, it will be long and sad.

To answer your question, how about this, Conform to the qualities of the culure that attracted you enough to it enough to leave your own country..

So what culture attracted the colonist of the mayflower?

You say multiculturalism is the view that all cultures around the world are equal? I support multiculturalism and I dont feel it has anything to do with equality. Culture has everything to do with your roots. The art, litterature, morals and philosiphies that have been passed down to you. Culture is what puts passion and meaning into peoples lives. I personally woul'dnt want to live in a monocultural (is that a word?) world.
You say "they" hate our culture and openness blah blah blah... what a load of shit. The middle east is fucked up man, its hell compared to the luxury we live in. It should have been obvious to anyone it was reaching boiling point, and the obvious target for its aggression was the U.S, the fucking cornerstone of western civilisation. I'm not condoning anything that has happened recently, I'm just saying that culture is only a fraction of the picture. Any civilization living in those conditions would have acted in a similar fashion, no matter what their culture was like. And who are "they" exactly? Thats one hell of a us and them mentality you have there. Do you view middle eastern culture as a threat? Why? Do you think those terrorists wont be fucking psycho's anymore without their culture. Or do you think that middle easterner's living in America are influenced to aid terrorists because of their culture. And if so, how do you propose we take it away from them? Tie them up and make them watch American T.V? Thats just sick man, just sick.
I guess my main point is that culture is the only thing that brings this world beauty. It's easy for you to talk about assimilation when America has no culture of its own. If anyone wanted to take my culture away in the name of safety, I would be more than willing to fuck them up.
Despite everything I've said I do think multiculturalism in America (and Canada) is a joke. All it is is the government funding cultural programs, commercials and what not so the many cultures living in the country won't get upset. If you wan't to support your culture, do it yourself. Promote the arts that stem from your ancestry. Don't let the world become covered by wallmarts and mcdonalds and white guys in suites going for business lunches.

To simplify my response to all those lazy people out there. Leave all cultures the fuck out of this. They bring beauty to the world. And thats about all we have considering we're just going to keep on killin' ourselves.

Ive tried to resist, but I must say one more thing. You say that if people are willing to leave their country for another they should conform to that country's way of life. Why? They probably left their country for a better life, and that better life includes the freedom to act how they want, unless they break the law of course. Who gives a fuck if some small minded shit feels uneasy when he see's a foreigner walking around in strange clothes? Booh fuckin hoo. And what about a child born to immigrant parents? He has every fucking right to study and even practice his culture if he feels so inclined.

so Monday Night Raw and Ally McBeal and Yahoo chat created the great American proserity, huh? culture, you cretins, is what a society creates, and since americans dont read anymore...it must be tv, music or the internet. i just love to brag to my korean friends about britney spears. do you want every girl under 18 dressing like the Silicone Slut? i think not. as for the great American prosperity, dont look at the stock market (now falling) dont salivate at Bill Gates' empire, instead, look at what people actually make. as for the Middle East being poor, some parts are, but Kuwait and Saudi Arabia (are allies, and where a majority of the hijakers and bin Laden are from) have free health care and college education for every citizen. america, my friends does not.

Im a multi-culturalist, and so despise the idea of peoples adopting traits of other nations and indoctrinating their youth into cults that seek to integrate various cultures and meld them. How does that lead to a multitude of cultures? What you have then is one big messy consumerist shit anti-culture defined and created by the media and special interests groups. The world is better when the Italians in the Italian neighborhood act Italian, the Irish act Irish, the Blacks act Black (Well, maybe not), the Arabs act Arab, and so on.

But if you live as an immigrant in another country, dont expect your culture to take priority over the native one.

spirt you have to accept that america has become as much a nation as those of Europe. should Italians speak latin Should the french worship the earth spirits of druidism should the spainards bathe.

Yes to all three.

Alan, you have to accept that the world is becoming more open and borders are eroding (although this process may be a bit rocky). Those, including you,lucky enough to be born in certain countries and with enough wealth have the freedom of packing their bags and moving to another world in search of a better life. Of course they have an obligation to learn about a new countries customs and respect them, but that doesn't mean they should have to give up their own. Take America for example, from the very founding of the country it wasn't just occupied by British colonists. There were German mercanaries (and probably other peoples in some other similar situation) hired to help fight the British during the war for independance. So, from the very begining it was a melting pot. Also, what about Americans who's ancestors were brought to this country as slaves. I'd say they definately have the right to practise their own culture. And if they do, then how does one draw a line on who does and who doesn't.