if time travel is possible or even feasable how would one time travel into the future or past and manage to get back to the exact moment of time they started without altering the entire time frame of the universe

this is actually a serious question

...no wonder people call me crazy

Here's to not using the archives...
http://www.totse.com/bbs/Forum25/HTML/000066.html http://www.totse.com/bbs/Forum25/HTML/000102.html http://www.totse.com/bbs/Forum25/HTML/000092.html

if everyone has an idea of how time travel works why dont we all just get together somewhere.. where no one can mess with us and just build a time machine

people's opinions may change, anyway since we can't do time travel we really can't comprehend the effects.

Buy the special issue of Scientific American that concerns time. I can't begin to explain it all to you. http://www.sciam.com/issue.cfm?issueDate=Sep-02

i know a site that sells time machines. its http://www.futurehorizons.net

It's all directions. I could sell you the directions for a time machine. I'd just leave it up to you to find the billions of dollars worth of materials to make it.

If Einstein was correct (and it certainly seems like he was!) time travel is not only possible, but happens on a regular basis in our universe.

On the other hand, if you're a sucker with a lot of money, you can buy yourself one of these insane devices: http://makemillions.bizland.com/hyperdimensional_resonator.htm

i heard if u chop off ur weener then u go back 10 mins. ummmm the whole subject is quite mind boggling, too much so that i wont go into it here, ill do it in my subconscious sleep like state tonite

You heard some pretty weird shit.

I believe that time travel is logically impossible.


If u were to go on the past. You probably would change the ways of the past, then it may happen that u never invent the time machine and how would u go to the past if in the present there is no time machine?

even if u went to the future ( which is only a theory [ it never happens, when it would arrive it becomes present!]) u couldn't go back and expect it to be the same way there would be different "time lines"

Mind if I ramble a bit?

Personally, I theorize time travel is possible. I even have some very crude theories on how to accomplish it, but I have no idea how to go about them without killing myself in the process.

One possibility that I think has been mentioned is that even if one could travel back in time, one could change nothing. This is because by going into the past, all actions would contribute to the creation of the present you originally experienced. Example, you tried to stop a bank robbery, but you accidentally tripped and fell into the security guard there, giving the robbers the chance they were waiting for. It's related to the predestination paradox, and that theory is the bane of any would be temporal interlopers.

Personally, I think that it's unlikely. For this kind of set up, the transmission of mass and energy would have to be set up outside of time as we know it somehow, by some master engineer of the universe who has a bizarre decorating sense. The same thing happened when scientists tried to explain the orbits of other planets while using the Earth as the center of the model: the charts showed a series of loops called epicycles, and it looked bizarre.

This 'closed theory of time' is especially popular amongst some physicists because it complies with the laws of thermodynamics, specifically the part about energy neither being created or destroyed, only converted.

I disagree.

I subscribe to the 'open time theory' which allows time travelers to make changes. This is because of a flaw in thermodynamics in general: It always involves a closed system in testing or proofing a principle, but nobody yet has learned to develop a closed, isolated system that can exclude gravity.

And Einstein proved that Time and Space and Gravity are all intimately connected. Furthermore, research into high voltage electromagnetics links electricity with gravity... all it takes as a few intuitive leaps of logic to come to the conclusion that time travel is possible.

But what of the paradoxical situations that may arise, hmmm? Well, let's look at a classic example. Say I charge up my Temporal Displacer and send myself back to 1930 or so. I go around and find my grandfather before he and my grandmother can have the baby which will eventually become my father. Everyone in my family tree that follows after them will disappear. Wait... that would include ME too, right? Uh oh.

I have two possible theories about what happens next, each depending upon the nature of the means used to travel through time.

1. If I used a method that kept me still attached to the line of causal events that resulted in my existence, then like wildfire, a chain reaction of new events will follow that link probably faster than light, eventually reducing me to nothing but random molecules and photons. The problem with this happening is that most people think that the result will destroy time and space because then I can never go back to prevent myself from existing in the first place. Or second place. Or... either way, or anyway, that you look at it, it boggles the mind and ergo, the mind thinks that the universe can't handle it either. I disagree. The instantaneous action that results in the moment I alter time so that my existence from that point on is impossible still occurs in the 'me-less' timeline, but in the form of random quantum uncertainty on a macroscopic scale. Ever heard of spontaneous combustion? Think of it like that, but resulting in the effects of a general result, not specific symptoms. It doesn't matter whether Gramps is incinerated or disintegrated or shredded or beheaded, something will spontaneously come about to result in his discontinued existence.

2. If the method used completely seperated you from the causal series in space time that lead to your existence, you're still around after Gramps bites the dust. However, if you try to return to your original time after this happens, you will find that the world you knew will be somewhat different... especially in that nobody knows who you are.

Strictly speaking, the further back you go in time, the more dangerous it becomes to try and change things. Not only for yourself, but for anything or anyone you happen to want to continue to exist (friends, family, favorite TV series, et cetera). I personally think that once you go back beyond your age in years, anything you do has a better than %50 chance of destroying your 'present'.

Of course there is always the multiverse theory that causes an exemption as well. In that theory if you go back in time and kill your ancestor you create a divergent timeline. In the alternate timeline your ancestor did die, and you were never born. However you came from the the timeline where your ancestor never encountered you at that time.

If time travel into the past was possible, wouldnt we already know from visitors from the future....?

I've my own plan for a time machine but it's way too complex for your limited-capacity brains.

If u think about it, we're alwayz traveling thru time, every moment of every day we're moving forward in time....so we don't have to learn to "time travel" we already do that without even trying. we just need to learn how to speed up time, (which would take us into the future) however, logically, in this situation traveling to the past would be impossible because you would have to make time go slower than stopped, which cannot happen....i don't think

how can we know the specifics about time travel if we don't even know time travel, as for the whole frame thing, well, if one goes back in time and alters something, like killing a famous leader, destiny will split into two, like the roots of a tree, speed and time seem to be linked, but time cannot be a two dimensional thing, therefore time may go faster or slower, depending on what time, time is at .....

We would not see visitors future has not happened yet the past has happened. You can travel back in time but not into the future.

quote:

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Originally posted by punkrawkerstonershit:
We would not see visitors future has not happened yet the past has happened. You can travel back in time but not into the future.

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Go back to the drugs. To some, the future is already past.

quote:

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Originally posted by Stuff:
If time travel into the past was possible, wouldnt we already know from visitors from the future....?

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that is a really good point. surely if it is possible then we are actually living in hte past of the already happened futre. what if tht person comes back and kills one person and the futre has already been changed in a multitude of ways.

quote:

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Originally posted by Stuff:
If time travel into the past was possible, wouldnt we already know from visitors from the future....?

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How do you know that we already haven't? I mean if it was possible, i don't think someone would travel back to our time and announce "HEY IM FROM THE FUTURE" If they did they would be considered crazy. Or the person would have the same fear of destroying the universe, and keep it secret.

But i think there are multiple universes, many of them, and each one is a universe where we would have made a different choice, so every possilbe outcome for everything and everyone already exists in different dimensions.

So if someone went to the past and fucked something up, they would split that timeline like how they stated above.

And we could be in a timeline that rarely gets visitors from the future.

Assuming that time travel is possible wouldn't it be highly regulated. Even more so than nukes because it has the potential for more damage.

I am surprised that no-one has yet mentioned methods of time travel. There are a few theroretical ways that it could be done.

1. Wormholes
These represent one of the most plauseable methods of time travel. There is one key issue that would need to be addressed, how to move a wormhole. This is important because this method relies on "time dilation" which is a derivitive of the therory of reletivity. It is in essance that as you speed up time slows down, so in order to apply this to wormholes it would be nessesary to move one end of the wormhole relative to the other. This would mean that the moved end would be further back in time than the other, this time gradient would allow for movement though time as well as space. Another way of achiving a time gradient is using special reletivity by having the two ends in gravitational fields of differing stengths.

2. Space-time bubbles
Another method is to create a bubble in space around yourself and detach it from the universe. You could then in theroy re-attach to any point in space-time. The main problems with getting this to work are bending space in the right way and detaching from and importantly re-attaching to the universe.

Since I tend to like stating my sources I mostly got this from Open University programs on BBC2. Despite which I still have problems getting number 2 to work in my head.

Another way that time travel in theory is possible is by making an area with a negative energy balance. Negative energy balances are theorized to be able to bend the space time continuim in the opposite way that it normally bends. I've read somewhere that the first computer ever built was actually built by Dr. Von Nueman which was a computer that was capable of accurately plotting out the coordinates of space and time so that the machine would be able to come back a specified point in time. The shit about Von Nueman is conspiracy shit though, and may not be true.
But the negative energy balance is in "A Brief history of time" or whatever it's called by hawkings

[This message has been edited by chase161 (edited 02-04-2003).]

We are al living in the past...

CTR