molecule is atoms
atom is proton, neutrons and electrons
so what is proton, neutron and electron ?

noone knows, its 2 small, but now im curious :P

the middle bit of an atom is made up of protons and neutrons bunched together in a ball. then orbiting around the ball is electrons. electrons have 1/2000 the weight of a proton or neutron (which way about the same). for example, in oxygen, there is 8 protons and 8 neutrons bunched together, with another 8 electrons orbiting around them.

I thought it was 1/1840 the weight of a proton or neutron.

Current theory says that protons and neutrons are made of quarks. As far as I know, electrons are still considered elementary particles. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.

Supposedly the very basic particles of the universe that make up everything are themselves just tightly bundled up strings of energy.

Elecrons are a higher energy state lepton, lower energy state leptons are lepton neutrinos, which are theorised to be the major constituent of cold dark matter, protons and neutrons are composed of both leptons (used to be called gluons) and quarks. Both quarks and leptons have 3 energy states, only one of which is commonly found outside of extremely high gravity/energy enviroments. 2 leptons + 1 quark make a neutron, as leptons have lesser mass, but a negative quantum alignment they are balanced out by the quark, 2 quarks + 1 lepton make a proton, the 2 quarks overcome the leptons negative alignment resulting in a positive quantum polarity. Do not believe anything of what I just said, it is based on very sketchy knowledge of quantum physics, gleaned from old Omni magazines, if anyone could point out where I am wrong I would be grateful.

[This message has been edited by culinaryoverlord (edited 10-20-2002).]

I think that is right, quarks have charges of 2/3, and electrons are made up of other parcitals alought im not sure what they are called.

CTR

I thought it was 1/1840 the weight of a proton or neutron.
its 1/1838 the wieght of a neutron, and 1/1836 the wieght of a proton.

it amazing how much free time you find when you do nothing but aviod studying.

I think its more like the electron is 9.45^10-23amu, verces the 1 amu of protons and neutrons.

CTR

1840 is close. A good rounded number. I know only what my chemistry book tells me (concerning the weight of electrons at least).

You know! They're made of STUFF!

Please don't confues "STUFF" with "stuff". Those terms refer to two entirely different classes of matter. I could probably go into a much more detailed explaination of the differences between those classes of matter, but frankly, I've probably already spoken over the heads of many reading this. So, I'll not endeavor to any further commentary.

" think its more like the electron is 9.45^10-23amu, verces the 1 amu of protons and neutrons."

thats like saying pi equals 3
if the science people heard you say that they would have a good ole' lynching.

but luckly i am here to fix everything.

now, for your enlightenment, i have the correct wieghts of the three. (from the back of a refrence card i found on a seat at a lecture, and for some reason kept, only to rediscover it yesterday after actually opening my chem book)

electrons weigh 9.0953x10-31kg
or 5.48580x10-4amu

protons weigh 1.67265x10-27kg
or 1.00728amu

neutrons weigh 1.67495x10-27kg
or 1.00866amu

now i hoped that cleared some things up. you may now proceed to thank me in an orderly fashion.

im not normally like this, but recent events (like nearly failing me mock chem exam) have brung certain things to my attention that need immediate remedy, things like what the hell is so special about an amphoteric metal. they keep getting mentioned, don't they realise that there is three of them verses like a hundred of the other ones. its not that big a deal just because i don't know what the hell happens to them in acid.

hey, i just realised that mixing alcohol with vinegar will give you nail varnish remover.
my point is that you can get high off alcohol.
you would need to use vodka though.

on the subject of vodka, i need to get a bottle for friday (last day of school), but im not having much luck.

update on the vodka-

asked dad to do it, and its all settled.

what i need is a big stock so i can just grab a bottle when i go out. pity im not in that financial situation though.

Looks like i confused mass and weight,

Ursus you never have spoken over the haeds of anyone, many people here has degrees in science, not saying you dont but their are many inteligent people here.

CTR

Yes culinary is right. Quarks are your answer, held together by gluons. Electrons are elementary particles they are indivisible as far as we know. There are six different kinds of quarks. Until recently this was just speculation based on obsevations, but a few(maybe 5) years ago they found the last one (a top quark) I think in a very high power particle accellerator, this is a very heavy quark heavier than a proton even.

Up, Down, Top, Bottom, Charmed, Strange

Mr. Overlord, you are close at first, but fall apart as you go along. Not bad, though, from memory of an old Omni article.

Here's what's what [finally, someone didn't beat me to the punch ]:

*I stand corrected: it seems, Tryp, that you posted while I was composing my reply. Boo! beat again* SoO some of what I wrote will be redundant because Tryp. has already said it. I'm not going to go through and remove it all: too dreary a task at the moment.


There are two basic types of fundamental particles one is the Lepton the other is the quark.

Leptons are either neutral or carry a charge of one whole electric unit. They have a spin value of 1/2.

There are three charged leptons, all are have a negative charge. The lightest of them is the electron [the other two are the muon and the tau]. Each of them have an associated neutral charged lepton [neutrino. thus electron - neutrino, muon neutrino, etc.]


[I'm not even going to go into anti-leptons here.]

As for the part they might play in cold dark mater, I'm think you are confused since leptons are relatively low in mass. Even the tau, which is 3,700 times the mass of an electron, is still not all that much when compared to the mass of a quark.

I think you must be thinking of the Higgs particle, no? Top quark, perhaps?


On to Quarks:[and I don't mean a bar on DS9]

Quarks have a spin of 1, and either a charge of 2/3 [the Up quark] or -1/3 [the Down quark] [There's also the Top, the Bottom, The Strange, and the Charmed quarks. But the original question only asked about the atom and that's only the Up and Down quarks. Otherwise, this could go on forever - even by the standards of my posts ]

Quarks combine to make up Baryons and Mesons.

Baryons, which are protons and neutrons [and corresponding anti-particles], are made of three quarks, but the total charge always has to equal either +1, 0, or -1 [which would be proton, neutron, anti-neutron, anti-proton].

In addition to spin and charge, quarks also have a property called 'color', which I'm also not going to go into.

One last thing I will mention are gluons. These are massless particles that transmit the force that binds quarks together, which is also known as the strong nuclear force.


[This message has been edited by Metaphysicist (edited 10-24-2002).]

man, i swear to go quarks or what ever they are called im still going with soon enough it will just be another univers

I'm still sot quite solid on why it is called a "charge", is this just for lack of a better term defining the quantum attraction between particles? I know a charge is a greater/lesser amount of electrons, how does this relate to subatomic particles? Also, how does the spin affect.. ah fuck it, I am going to go buy a book on the subject, can you reccomend one?
Something in between quantae for dummies and a college textbook would be nice. As for my post, heh heh, the Omni information ran out about halfway through, everything after that is intuitive bullshit.

Superstrings: A Theory of Everything?, ed. P.C.W. Davies and J. Brown, Cambridge University Press, 1988; Mirror Manifolds, ed. S-T. Yau, International Press, (1992); B. R. Greene, P. S. Aspinwall and D. Morrison, Multiple Mirror Manifolds and Topology Change in String Theory, Physics Letters B303, (1993) 249; E. Witten, Phases of N = 2 Theories in Two Dimensions, Institute for Advanced Studies Preprint IAS-HEP-93-3.

Time life books made an excellent series once that contained a book on subatomic physics. Very readable and very thourough.